Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

I would like to create an original AI for the pirates shipset.
As TDM seems to be the best mod for good AIs, perhaps I will make it for that mod.

So I would like to know :

- Are AI files very different than in unmodded game ?

- What make races smarter with that mod ?

- Does TDM AIs still working in unmodded game ? (even if they are less efficient)

[ April 11, 2003, 23:20: Message edited by: trooper ]

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The AI files are the difference.

The Data files (with the tech tree, components, facilities, etc, etc), are exactly the same.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

Dogscoff confused things (as usual http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif )

TDM is a standard game with more elaborate AI files. People just went through files and paid details to minute things that all the importance for AI performance, like optimized research, better ships design, efficient ship building, etc.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

Now I got it. In fact, TDM is not a mod, it's only a "advanced shipset collection"...

Well, I've got now to create a good AI for my pirate race, with TDM races as models.

Dogscoff have suggested me to create a colorful speech file with typical pirate language, but i'm afraid my poor english vocabulary is a bit weak for that. Would someone be interested in witing that file ?

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The AI files are the difference.

The Data files (with the tech tree, components, facilities, etc, etc), are exactly the same.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Actually... formations.txt is a data file, and is modded. So, they are not all exactly the same. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

[quote]Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:

Quote:

Actually... formations.txt is a data file, and is modded. So, they are not all exactly the same. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Good point.
But also, does exist a change into the settings.txt that makes a more important difference: in the standard game the max number for units in space are 1000 and ships are 200. In the TDM, the limit for both are 20,000.
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

[ March 17, 2003, 21:54: Message edited by: Master Belisarius ]

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

I see the TDM as a superb AI collection with very nice nice shipsets.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I am a New England Sailor http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif
I would be happy to do the Pirate speech file for you for next week; if you like trooper?

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

That's good news. Of course I agree !

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

So it shall be !

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">No, they are exactly the same as the unmodded game. TDM does not change the techs or any other aspect of the game: It just improves the AI for the standard game.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The same things that make the Ai smarter for the standard game.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yes, see above.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">They aren't.

Perhaps you could attempt an AI for the P&N mod, seeing as it's a pirate shipset. That would be cool.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

I haven't understooden everything...
What is the diference between TDM and Unmodded game if everything is identical ???

AI for P&N : Suicide Junkie himself wrote somewhere that playing a Pirate Race was far two difficult for the poor SE IV AI. ( I find it far too difficult for me as a human player indeed...)
So I think it would be a waste of time.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

How is going the speech work ?

I made great advances on the AI (too bad I missed the Last AI deathmatch registration, in order to see how effective it is).

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif Still have pb with the #%&£'ing fighter designs (unable to build missile fighters AND DUC fighters) and with the boarding ships that never capture anything... not talking about troop transports that don't join the attacking fleets http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif ! but I'm hoping to have something that work in the end.

Also realised 11 neostandard pictures, aiming for the 20, as usual... and don't talk to me about neostandard++, I won't work for it until I'm payed for it !!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">What system have you? If you have Win95 or Win98, you can run your own test, using the same map/settings/races of the contest.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

Use a standard hull for troop transport and it will join fleets. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">But troop transport with standard ships also works... In fact my AIs NEVER use Standard transports or Standard Carriers.
The Troop transports (with Transport hull or Ship hull, no mather) first need to have some troops loaded (something like 50% of capacity), and then, should have a nearest fleet to join.

[ March 24, 2003, 23:24: Message edited by: Master Belisarius ]

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

Transport hulls or not, AI should include troop transports in fleets. It might be a problem before but currently I did not see any problems with fleeting troop transports based on transport hulls http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yes Oleg, we agree 100%.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

M. Belisarius : I run under W2k.
If you can explain to me how you run your automatic tests, I'll be interested.

Until now, I put the race on full AI, and press the next turn key, looking at little ships moving here and there. It's...deadly boring.
And the AI keep on asking me stupid questions such as "Master, what type of colony should I build on this planet ? -You idiot, build a disneyland colony, it will increase happiness in the neigbourhood." or "Master, there are ennemy ships on my way, should I bLast them ? -"Surely not, you've built these 20 warships just for parade, don't you remember that, moron!"

Perrin : Lol. JLS is working on a better speech file, I think !

Others : My troop ships are too big, I'll have to limit their size to small transport, or it takes too much time to fill them with troops, and when there are ready to fight, there is no ennemy colonny left !

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">You can get rid of this question. In the empire status window under empire options uncheck "display select colony type dialog when colonizing". The AI will then follow your orders from the planet_types-file.

[ March 25, 2003, 20:09: Message edited by: Rexxx ]

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Sorry... but the SE4 Batch program doesn't work with W2k.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Well, you could use the Rexxx advice... or run your AI in simultaneous games.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

So could somebody list their impressions of the races for TDM- which are considered "good" AIs to play against in single player? What are bad combinations to use?

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Think you could check the second AI Death Mach, that I'm running: http://www.shrapnelgames.com/cgi-bin...;f=23;t=008233

The results for the first contest were:
1) Narn Regime
2) Pyrochette
3) EEE and United Flora
5) Aquilaeian and Earth Alliance.

About bad combinations... don't know. If you want a more challenging game don't play in big galaxies, and give high bonus to the AI.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

I have read it, but there are so many combinations http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif Second round isnt done there yet, is it?
Sometimes I am like the vast masses- wanting a simple "rank" table for my smooth, uncratered brain to digest...

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

The AI should put a standard troop transport into a fleet, but the larger cargo space (taking longer before it is sufficiently full, or being pulled out to load some more troops in a nearby system), and slower speed will cause some problems.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif
Just take a speech file that you like and add Arr! to the end of of each line. "Mineral planets are the best. Arr!" http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

[ March 25, 2003, 12:50: Message edited by: Perrin ]

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif The round 2 was finished, and the 3rd round is going well.

Space Vikings 1
Namovans 0
Khrel 2

Pyrochette 2
EEE 1
Sallega 0

Fazrah 1
Aquilaeian 2
Rage 0

United Flora 2
Cue Cappa 1
Earth Alliance 0

Tessellate 2
Gron 0
Orks 1

Toron 1
Narn Regime 1
Piundon 0

Based in the current results (and previous), think probably the following races will be not in the next round: Namovans, Sallega, Rage, Earth Alliance, (Orks or Gron), Piundon.

I wanted to run the contest into a fair map for all the races... but it's not 100% possible, then, the results would be not 100% fair.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

Stil trying to solve my multi-fighter design pb...

Is it possible to create a fighter design using the drone design name (I don't plan to use drones, so there is a unused design name) :

Name := DUC Interceptor
Design Type := Anti-Ship Drone
Vehicle Type := Fighter
Default Strategy := Fighter Attack
Size Minimum Tonnage := 10
Size Maximum Tonnage := 5000
Num Must Have At Least 1 Ability := 0

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Should work fine, I used to use Recon Satellites to do the same thing until a patch durring the change from 1.49 to Gold prevented the AI from building more than 1 Recon Sat per turn on each planet. Try looking at your fighter files some more, I've seen some AI's building multiple fighter designs without a problem.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

What races use two different fighters ?
I've got to see that working to believe it.

[ April 07, 2003, 20:01: Message edited by: trooper ]

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">If you have Proportions 2.5.3 installed, take a look on my Krill AI (i posted it in downlod section some time ago). There must be some AI for normal SE, I simply refer to the one I made.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

Does proportion change design names ? because the problem comes from the fact that there is only one design name for fighters in stock game and TDM mod. I think that proportions uses bomber, interceptors, doesn't it ?

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

But you should not have the problem with different types of fighters ! Many AIs build them. It really must be some small bug in your files you can not find yet http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif

As to drone turned fighter, I am afraid AI will not load them on carriers but on drone carriers instead. Never tried it though.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

Ok, I gonna test the orks in stock game and see if those Fighta-Bommas and bombas are actualy built.

I'll give you the results...

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

Just what I was expecting for the orks : Only the first design in the designcreation file is constructed (fighta-bomma). The bomba fighter design is not used.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

Which AI set did you use for the Orks? For a long time I was having a problem with them not building the Bombers, but a couple of days before the Last AI Deathmatch started I caught that the spelling (used Bomba in Construct Vehicle, and Bomma in Design Creation) between the Design Creation file and the Construct Vehicle file were differen. As soon as I corrected the spellings, they had started building both.

(It may take a little while until the AI has reached lines for both in the Construct Vehicle file)

[ April 08, 2003, 15:22: Message edited by: Atraikius ]

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

There is no difference between Proportions and stock game regarding design types for AI useage. It is hard coded. I urge you again, take a look on my Proportions Krill. It first build "attack fighters", then swith to "fighters" and later on build mix of "fighters" and "bombers".
You probably did not see multiple designs for Orks because of particular combination of planets and construction_vehicles entries. Just a guess, long time since I played unmoded SE.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

I've seen the TDM Krill, Orks, and Zorians use multiple fighter designs. I used an Interceptor and a Bomber design in the Design Creation file, and then only used the names in the Construct Vehicle design, making sure I didn't call for just "Fighter": try having one line call for Interceptor with a per planet value of 4, followed by Bomber with a per planet setting of 2, then Interceptor again with a per planet value of 1.

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

For your Pirates & Nomads games (and other mods).

http://diesel2035.free.fr/pirates/pi...rait_barge.jpg http://diesel2035.free.fr/pirates/pi...eshipheavy.jpg http://diesel2035.free.fr/pirates/pi...sourceship.jpg http://diesel2035.free.fr/pirates/pi...warstation.jpg

barge baseship heavy resource ship war station

- Full neostandard compliant.
- Optimized AI files designed for stock game.
- Political & speech files by JLS.

http://diesel2035.free.fr/pirates
(a bit slow tonight...)

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

Trooper, your set looks fantastic.

I am downloading them now and they will be in action in my next game.

Thanks

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Thanks, but it's a bit yours too !

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

A Pirates wallpaper is available, for all space pirates fans !

I'm not enterely pleased with this image (just took the fllet picture and added a background), I'll try to make another one, soon.

I should extend my RAM (bryce is very greedy when dealing with such pictures), or my hard drive is gonna melt !

http://diesel2035.free.fr/pirates/fleets.jpg

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

Great work Trooper, i would use it but my current desktop is a picture of my girlfriend, it would take an amzing shipset to top her beauty, but you come slightly close http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

Space pirates 2.0 also available on PBW file library. Hope to see lots of pirates players in the futures games !

[ April 14, 2003, 15:45: Message edited by: trooper ]

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

Thanks Trooper. I mean that, thanks for doing the Race directroy and for the kind words. And for that great Shark ship set. THAT SET IS JUST INCREDABLE. *druel* And the Pirate set 2.0 is just as impressive.

One of these days we will have to have a ship set awards thread. Nominate your favorite set (Not your own) and cast a vote. I will bet money that your Shark set takes Top honors and the Pirate set a close second. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

But I will have to admint the Starwolf / Cardassian / 8472 and Dominion sets will give you good run for you money. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Pirates shipset Version 2.0 available
 

Wow, thanks, I'm loved here... I Wish I was as appreciated where I live, I would find a job more easily !

Raging Deadstar, perhaps this new wallpaper will supplant your girlfriend's picture :

http://diesel2035.free.fr/pirates/fighter_releases.jpg

"Fighter Release"

[ April 20, 2003, 08:41: Message edited by: trooper ]