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OT: computers
I am looking to upgrade and purchase a new coputer and am wondering what computers you prefer…price vs realiablity
I currently have a Compaq and it freezes up every so often ans changes my desktop setting which is a real pain in the ***. What brands do you think are good and what processors do you think are good? Any that you wopuld never buy again? Thank you. |
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If I had a choice I'd never go for a brand computer, pick the components yourself and slot them in.
If I had to choose a brand I'd propably go with Dell that usually has good prestanda for the bucks, altough they are a bit noisy. Stay clear of Compaq (If you can find any) and HP who usually have their own solutions to things, solutions that aren't always so good. Also they sometimes tend to be sparse with upgrade space, few free slots and custom crammed cabinets. IBM used to make good PC's, but I don't know if they still do though. As to processors you can't really go wrong. Choose anyone that is reasonably fast, it doesn't matter if it's AMD or Intel. Both are good. (Oh, don't let this become a Intel/AMD war, I'm so boooored with them). Can't say much about Apples computers as I rarely use them. Or why not buy a Sprint Plus? Where to buy a Sprint Plus [ April 01, 2003, 20:17: Message edited by: Ruatha ] |
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my .02
Best solution (if you can handle it) = Build it yourself Second best solution = I prefer to find a local "whitebox" company that builds PC's and gives a decent warranty. That way you have a local place to go if something goes wrong, they will customize it for you for gaming and most "whitebox" computers can easily be upgraded. In the Boston, MA USA area, I like www.pcsforeveryone.com. This is probably the best solution IF you have a decent idea of what you want and why, OR if you trust them (find out how long they have been in business. A legitimate business will have references available on request, but might not have a list of "gamer" references) Third best solution = See if someone here bought a Dell, Compaq, etc for gaming and is happy with it. Buy that one. Fourth best solution (first best solution if you have wads of cash) = www.alienware.com |
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I bought a Inspiron 8200 from Dell. That is there desktop replacement for gaming. I will not buy anything other than a notebook designed for this purpose. I have been happy with Dell and they offered the best price for this type of unit. I had a wireless network card put in it and signed up for DSL and I love it. I can be anywhere in the house, be hooked up to the internet and it performs like a desktop.
My 2 cents. |
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[ April 01, 2003, 20:24: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ] |
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</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">That is not the issue we are talking about, that is a cooling issue that you need to adapt to the individual processor. An intel processor has different fan mounts than an AMD. What we are talking about is prestanda. Ofcourse you have to adapt the cooling to the heat, that is obvious. There are millions of AMD processors running perfectly! Fyron, I really think that sometimes.. (Won't start that thread again...) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif [ April 01, 2003, 20:36: Message edited by: Ruatha ] |
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You should custom build - it's not like the bad old days when you had to deal with IRQs etc. With windows everything is plug and play. You can get best of breed components for a lot less - especially if you go mail order. Also if anything goes wrong you will know how to fix it - sure they have maintenance contracts, but who wants to be down for a couple of days? - and these cost money!
If you're adventurous you can get an AMD cpu because they are easier to overclock so you can get more bang for your buck. Also AMD compatible motherBoards tend to be less expensive. If money is no object and you don't like to tweak once your up and running then a pentium is better. A good place start to get information is http://www.tomshardware.com [ April 01, 2003, 20:56: Message edited by: rextorres ] |
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You can also check Anandtech at http://www.anandtech.com/ p.s. Has anyone checked out the Sprint plus yet? it's NOT an april fools day joke! d.s. |
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PC Club has good PCs and hardware.
They usually use the best stuff. checkout their WEB site... The real question is 3D or not to 3D. If your not playing demanding 3D games then you can save a couple of hundred dollars and go with a lightweight processor (RONs - DuRON or CeleRON)and the (motherBoards) intergrated graphics, and regular speed RAM. If you will be playing recent 3D games then you want a heavy weight processor (Athalon or Pentium) and a recent 3D graphics card, and the Dual Data Rate (DDR) RAM. |
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I have to Agree with Iorn Giant
I have been shopping at www.pcsforeveryone.com for at least 5 years. Take a look at their Shuttle pc. www.shuttle.com I just bought one for Pooh Star. It is about 6 x 7 x 12 inches. Not much room for expansion but for non graphics intensive work it is superb. If not, then I feel DELL is a good buy. |
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I never said anything even remotely related to AMDs not being able to work. Nothing in my post even comes close to such a statement. |
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I never said anything even remotely related to AMDs not being able to work. Nothing in my post even comes close to such a statement.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Then you should also mention that it aswell draw more power and so costs more in the long run. And the issue about thermal safety features built into the processors. And ofcourse the difference in the chipsets (a real issue), what about rambus memory? Colour of the chips? status? etc etc. When someone asks what processor should I get they usually means wich processor gives me best prestanda. The one starting this thread talked about brand computers and weren't specifically talking about putting his own computer together, quite the opposite. All brand computers come equipped with ample cooling devices. You've got to differ between what is an issue and what is showing off. Fyron, try someting new: Don't get the Last post in an argument/discussion! Anxiety? (Sorry if I'm ranting but its 02.30 in the night, I'm tired and aren't allowed to go to sleep, work related) [ April 02, 2003, 00:27: Message edited by: Ruatha ] |
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AMD have a very good and detailed guide to installing Athlon processors downloadable from their website. VERY good.
Basically, read that and make sure you get an approved fan. Get a nForce 2 or KT-333 or KT-400 chipset motherboard. Make sure you have a 350+ Watt PSU. That solves the AMD "problem". If you're going branded, can't really help unless you're a UKer. The companies I'd recomend are all UK-only [ April 02, 2003, 01:25: Message edited by: Dawn Falcon ] |
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Based on the first post, I think he needs a boxed computer. This means he should buy the
fasted Dell that he can afford. He was an OC’er, he would not have made the post. Building your own, results in more speed for buck spent. But can be a problem for someone that is not up to speed on trouble shooting problems. |
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memory timings to work out, and no split bus multipliers to trip you up. And Tom’s is the laughing stock of the PC forum world. He switches sides faster than processors go obsolete. Try this place if you want to get some fair answers. http://www.sharkyforums.com/ |
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Heh...
I'd recomend [H]ard OCP and Annandtech over Toms or SE. The SE forums used to be a pit when I posted there, although admitedly that was some time ago. |
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What can you bring over from your old pc..... and what is your budget.
I do highly recommend that you get a nvida 2 chip set and a nice amd chip... Remember it is more important to get the best motherboard money can by than the best cpu as you can always do a cheap upgrade in the cpu in a year or 3 when the best out now is dirt cheap in a few years. But for Bang for the BUck your not going to beat a nvida 2 chipset with amd. 333mhz ram etc... Post what you got and what you can afford.. If you want to take it off line send me a pm... I will gladly help out and send you some links... I have many good ones at work... which is not where i am at now... |
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An easy and in this case accurate translation would be: "How fast does programs run on it." |
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Here is what you do (take it from me, I am a computer programmer!! Woot):
Go to www.tomshardware.com Read some reviews, find a "do it yourself" page. You can really learn a lot in a short amount of time. Next, go to www.newegg.com they are the best retailer of parts I have ever known. Order parts. Build computer. I have had great success with the following companies' parts: For motherBoards, MSI, I have heard that Gigabyte is good, couple others I cannot remember. Just make sure the processor socket on the motherboard is the same as the processor you want, and that the RAM sockets is the same kind as you are going to buy too. If you want extra USB ports, motherBoards can have them. For processors, I am a fan of Intel myself, but AMDs are good too. I just rather get Intels, because they are usually the best supported and the fastest. Crucial, Kingston, and I have heard that OCZ are all good brands of RAM (I have heard horror stories about dirt cheap RAM, so you cannot trust the low bidder) Video cards is pretty much how much you want to spend. Top of the line is NVidia FX, very expensive and very loud. Tomshardware has excellent comparison charts. For a sound card, I only buy Creative. There really is not much competition. Get an Audigy2 and you will have top notch quality (at a high price, depending on which model) I prefer Plextor CD-RWs, and I would wait on getting a DVD-RW drive. They are expensive and there is 2 standards that need sorted out first. I should go into business by making custom PCs. Itd be fun. Edit: I forgot about powersupplies. Basically, more is good, and the most you'll ever need is maybe 350 to 400W, but there are many cheapo brands out there. I think Chieftec and Antec are good brands, but I cannot remember. [ April 02, 2003, 04:46: Message edited by: Instar ] |
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Cool! I just learned a new word: "prestanda"! I'll try to work it into a conversation tomorrow when I talk to my co-workers: "Hey, my new computer has more prestanda than yours." or "How can I increase the prestanda on this PC here?" It will surely confuse them. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif Thanks, Ruatha.
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You can use it in many different fields, cars, all type of things producing some sort of result. What is the equalent english word? I'll have to check the Swedish-English word book when I get home! |
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Thank you for all the help.
I really don't think I am up for the challenge of building my own just yet...all I have really done with mine is upgrade the RAM, CD and replace the modem. Just seems like there is too much I need to know before doing it and I would be clueless as to how to fix and keep it running smoothly. Compaq cannot even keep my computer running smoothly. It looks like Dell is the computer for me. If only I could afford that kick-*** Alien one. |
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How about this: post your current system specs and maybe you could just upgrade the one you have and save a bundle. That will give you the confidence you need to build your own from scratch the next time. Once you've got the confidence you'll figure out why you don't have any respect for the Compaq people: the home built computers are the best. Once you've started designing and building your own, you'll figure out what Compaq does wrong and you'll never buy a prefab again... [ April 02, 2003, 15:35: Message edited by: Iron Giant ] |
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If you go for a brandname pc, I would go Dell, or (maybe) Gateway. The first pc I bought was from TigerDirect, they sell both parts and preconfigured systems, you could give them a try as well, have purchased only parts from them since that first pc.
TigerDirect Should you or anyone else be looking for parts, this is a good site: Parts site |
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Problem with using pricewatch is that you end up buying all your parts from varying sources... sending shipping through the roof. Also, many companies hold fire sales or whatever just to get the lowest price on pricewatch
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You can use it in many different fields, cars, all type of things producing some sort of result. What is the equalent english word? I'll have to check the Swedish-English word book when I get home!</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">There are lots of word translators on the internet. I found one from Google but not all the formatting copied over: Swedish entry word prestanda [²prest'an:da] noun plural det som kan presteras (av en maskin), prestationsförmåga English translation performance Examples bilen har goda prestanda---the car has good performance Slick. |
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Okay I tried to figure out to the best of my ability what I have.
Bought an off the shelf Compaq Presario 7470. Processor AMD-K5-2 533Mhz Upgraded to 512 168 pin DIMM SDRAM I have 1 CD-R drive and space for a 2nd but no corresponding hook-up for the wire inside unless I pull the 3.5 floppy. 20 GB memeory I couldn't find out much more but did come across this information VIA Tech 3038 PCI ?motherboard? Board ID 648 Base Board 0648h I e-mailed compaq to send me a part list, we'll see if I get it if so I will post it. Here is what I want to do/have... faster system/better processor Have a 2nd disk drive for easier copying of disks Install and ehternet card Upgrade to WinXP And possibly upgrade my hard disk space to 40 or 60 GB. I will use it for gaming*, internet surfing, wordprocessing, digital photography and CD-burning And suggestions...and again thank you. *SEIV, Alpha Centauri, Jagged Alliance, etc., no 3-D/FPS games more strategy/sim based |
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Is there a PCI slot avaiable in the case and motherboard for a network card? What is the Wattage output of the powersupply? (230w - 250w - 300w - 350w - 400w) What is your video card? Random, off the top of my head idea: AMD 1800+ - 512mb ram - new Motherboard (this is dependant on the powersupply being compatible and capable) $150 Generic Network card $30 Windows XP $100 60 Gig hard disk installed as D: $75 Good case fan well placed to increase air flow in the case $20 $375 and that includes shipping. It saves your 20 gig and your burner and your video card and gives you a reason do do it yourself. Even better idea if you can afford it: Do the above AND buy a brand name computer so you have 2 computers. When you are building a computer and don't have one thats already working, you tend to cut corners to save time. *WARNING* I can't help you if something goes wrong. None of these parts will have a warranty to speak of (some RAM and processors are 30 days!). If you need a computer to do your job, or if you don't think its worth learning to do this yourself, buy a full computer. |
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I think Hunkpappa would have too much upgrading to do to make it worth while.
My old AMD-K6 was not worth the effort because it was an AT format case, not the AT-X case. The AT connectors and their locations are different from the AT-X, so the keyboard, power supply, and case can not be reused. (motherboard upgrade). Maybe you can keep it as a second system and drop a network card in it. Then you could play SEIV head to head. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif Or maybe you can give it to a poorer relative, like I did. Check out this link: http://www.pcclub.com/systems_config...p&bomid=EN-ME6 Less money, but I suggest you upgrade the memory and hardrive a little... http://www.pcclub.com/systems_config...p&bomid=EN-PF4 These system do not come with a monitor. My old monitor was not plug-n-play and that became too much of a setup pain. The hardrive can be partitioned. The system will act like each partition is a seperate drive. I hope I am helping you... [ April 03, 2003, 16:03: Message edited by: Wardad ] |
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- A second floppy? I haven't used mine in ages, but you can get them for about $5. With a CD burner, you can get a rewritable disk for a buck or two, and carry a 650 meg "floppy" around http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif There is free software around which will make it act exactly the same as your standard 3.5" floppy (except bigger, and faster).
- All you need in an ethernet card comes in at under $25. If its much more than that, it will be loaded with useless features, like the ability to turn your computer on remotely. - WinXP may or may not be an "upgrade", depending on your point of view http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif - You can easily boost yourself into the 1500 Mhz range for $150 these days. - DVD burners are about the same price ($150). If you just want a CD burner its less ($50), and read-only CDs go for $20. - Hard Drives are roughly $1 per Gigabyte of storage, with almost 200 Gig drives appearing lately. Going from 60 to 80 will probably cost you only $10 more, depending on the store. Quote:
Usually, the CD and Harddrive cables have three connectors on them (one at each end, and one in the middle), and motherbords come with two connections for them. That gives you room for a total of 4 CDs and HDs. The floppy cables are set up in a similar way, so adding a second drive will be easy. If need be, you can buy fresh "IDE" cables for $1.99 |
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All of the advice here is good, but let me give you a little word to the wise. Do not try your first major upgrade on your only computer. And be careful of upgrading name brand computers, some of them use proprietary designs on the motherboard, power supplies, and cases. These
can make upgrading very difficult. Also, be sure that you have access to someone who is experienced and willing to help you if things don’t work out. My first home built started with the motherboard DOA. I was instantly in over my head. Look at Dells site, they have a 2GHz P4 w/17”moniter for 599 right now. Add a $45 dollar CD reader and some memory to that and it will be just what you need. Then if you want to try home building, buy a book on A+, read it and practice on the Compaq. [ April 03, 2003, 16:15: Message edited by: Thermodyne ] |
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good advise Thermodyne..
I have seen old DELLS, Compacs, and others that had custom power connectors and motherboard sizes. It kills your abiltiy to upgrade later. The DELLS with the better processors and graphic cards started at $799. |
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It looks like it is a no go with upgrading what I have effectively, thnak you all for the input.
Dell seems to be the best deal mentioned, any thoughts on this company... http://www.buyabs.com/ |
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looks GOOD to me...but...
I'd upgrade to a Western Digital Hard Drive, I do not know about the Motherboard Brand and would look for reviews on the web. [ April 04, 2003, 16:39: Message edited by: Wardad ] |
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Since a personal upgrade is out of the question.
Perhaps you should narrow your choices down to the dell route or perhaps a local mom and pop who has a good reputation. Trade in your old puppy for some money off on the new one... Or as a third option keep the old guy around and play with it... and learn how to build and destroy computers... But I would save the 20 gig drive.... it will come in use .... Just remember that you do not need the high end CPU, just get a good motherboard. THe only things you could salvage would be the harddrive, floopy, cdr , and perhaps the sound card..... Good luck... keep to your budget. 512 megs ram 1800 nvida 2 chip set with onboard nic , ( perhaps onboard sound card ) dvd / cd / cdr combo oem ( lite on or some thing like that ) 60 gig hard drive video card ( Geforce middle of the pack one ) oem soundbLaster oem your set.... Will not rob the bank and next year you can upgrade the cpu or memory when things slow down abit... which i doubt they will... |
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Hunkapapa,
How is it hanging? |
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Still mullying over my 2 choices, would like to have the future upgrade available, don't want to get stuck topped out like I am currently.
I am definitely buying a pre-made now, but I will seriously be considering building my own in the next 3-5 years. Must importantly I cleared it through the boss (wife). the old one is being donated to a family member Thank you all for your help. [ April 08, 2003, 22:26: Message edited by: Hunkpapa ] |
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AMD: Great products but the company is sitting on a mountain of debt. Will they be in buisness when you want to upgrade? Can they afford to keep up with Intel? Intel: Sitting on a mountain of cash. Will the next P4 or P5 be compatible with your current hardware? |
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The upgrade path is different today than it was in the past. Memory is evolving just as fast as
CPU’s, so the benefit of reusing the motherboard are greatly diminished during an upgrade. These days we are often finding that a replacement CPU is a cheap upgrade, and cost effective for a one or two year SLE. We can flash the BIOS and the replace a 500mhz PIII with a Celeron getting a 100% increase in speed theoretically. Add a new hard drive and we have less than $150 dollars in a system that we expect to get 3 more years out of. CD and floppy readers get pulled or disabled so no troubles there. We run Citrix, so CPU speed was not a big issue, but now that we have rolled out with a compliant serverbased antivirus system, the older workstations are beginning to really suffer. We have some 400MHz Deskpros that take 16 minutes to boot and scan a 20Gig drive. Also, someone posted about AMD being the inexpensive upgrade path. Need to look at the price sheets again there. Amd has started a campaign to regain profitability and XP’s are priced right up there with P4’s these days. Performance is great on both brands, so it is a case of preference these days. |
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I can't say that we've ever done this where I work. But I can remember cutting off part of the I/O shield to make it fit a slightly different case design. |
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Wardad, given the speed of evoloution of chipsets and memories these days, don't worry about what happens 2-2 1/2 years down the line when you want an upgrade.
You WILL need a whole new CPU/Motherboard/Memory anyway. And AMD have their 64-bit chips to use in the mainstream market, Intel don't. And Intel are continuing to lose market share over here. |
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I was not worried... I was helping Hunkpapa.
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I can't say that we've ever done this where I work. But I can remember cutting off part of the I/O shield to make it fit a slightly different case design.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The four holes around the CPU are not needed on the tray. These holes are for the push rivets that attach the lower fan bracket to the MB. Even on the units I OCed and had Swifties on, the holes were not needed in the tray. There is another mounting hole that is relocated, but if it is not used it doesn’t hurt anything. |
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set for a new surge starting next week. But the 64 bit home CPU is still in doubt. The home Version will be locked at 32bit. And it will be much later in on the shelves than the server chips. Also, the price of the AMD 64 bit windows is going to be a real shocker when people get around to that. I hear that Linux has been ported the AMD64, but that will not be the same as a $150 64 bit Version of Win XP. |
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