Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Over in the Verduran Cooperative thread Oleg was musing about what would have happened in the Alpha Centauri (Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri - game by Firaxis) universe if the factions had gone to different planets instead of just one. I thought that sounded like a good idea for a mod, and input from Hugh Manatee and TerranC suggested that there might (maybe) be some interest in such a project. I have some ideas and concerns about it, so I thought I would open a new thread to discuss the possibility.

First the concerns:

1. I am greatly concerned about the copyright problem (especially after skimming the thread on the subject). I imagine that we would need explicit permission from Firaxis to do this, and I wonder if we could get it.

2. I have zero experience with modding. So, we'll need alot of expert help to pull this off.

Now the ideas:

1. The Alpha Centauri theme would hold everything together; Progenitors leaving advanced technology around (ruins) and perhaps arriving at inopportune moments to attempt recapture (not sure how to mod this, or even if it is possible). Human factions spread around the quadrant: Cyborgs (AST, good research, low growth), Believers (Religious, slow research), Spartans (low construction, good space combats), Gaians (Organic), Hive (good construction and growth, slow research), and Drones (hearty industrialists). All of these would be rock oxygen in SEIV terms.

2. To spice things up I thought we could add some neutrals and the Pirates who would be ice oxygen.

3. The tech tree and components could be modified to reflect some of the names from SMAC, like N-Space Compression, Planet Buster, Shard Cannon, etc. Costs for the weapons, shields, and components could be balanced so there are a number of equal choices at any point in the game.

4. QNP and leaky shields would also be nice, so the mod can take advantage of the latest thinking in SEIV.

So, if this is actually going to happen, we'll need a lot of help. Hugh Manatee has volunteered to do a shipset for the Progenitors. I can do one for the Pirates. We'll need more volunteers for shipset design, AI design, and (most importantly) a lot of help with the tech trees, components, and QNP.

Would anyone be interested in working on a mod like this?

[ July 09, 2003, 03:50: Message edited by: Chronon ]

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Try my Tech Gridder (link)

It'll help you pump out hundreds of components and facilities in seconds to fill out your tech trees.

Also, If you have any questions, just ask.
I believe the local policy is still "30 minutes or its free" http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Thanks SJ, the Tech Gridder looks like a great tool. I'll experiment with it a little and let you know if I have any questions.

That's a good point Oleg. I guess we can just put in some sort of disclaimer like Atrocities has in his Star Trek ship set "read me" files, and hope we don't get a nasty letter from Firaxis' lawyers. It's not like we're selling anything. And, I'm sure they are not making any more money from SMAC, so we're not cutting into their profit, either.

Do we have any more volunteers for ship sets?

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

my, chronon thats a great idea there! plus you can easily extract images from the game...

Pirates, well, remember for one the Native life - using rollo's monsters as a base we can make them pretty nasty... they'll have null-space type weapons (SKIP ALL) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
Now there are some factions there that could be piratized.

We even have naming files! (the city names in the game). Speech shouldnt be a problem, either way its all too similar in the game http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

GOod idea. For what i can, i will help you.

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

"1. I am greatly concerned about the copyright problem (especially after skimming the thread on the subject). I imagine that we would need explicit permission from Firaxis to do this, and I wonder if we could get it."

Do not worry about it.

"2. I have zero experience with modding. So, we'll need alot of expert help to pull this off."

Check out SE4 Modding 101 Tutorial, linked in my sig. It is a great way to get a start in modding SE4.

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Haaa ? How do you think we have StarTrek and Babylon5 mods http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif If we bothered Paramount for StarTrek license... Oh, dear !

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Ok technically Planet was an all Nitrogen and CO2 and fungus. I think we should reflect this in the game. They should be able to colonize as many worlds as they want and it should all be the same but should be more comfortable on Oxegen. IRL there are very litle life supporting oxegen planets.

I think instead of mineral plants and organics farms and radioactives facilities and research centers we should have it set up so you have to build new "Bases" on your planets. These different bases produce a little of all of the resouses and a lot of one specific resouce(eg. a headquarters base produces like 500 of each resourse and has the ability to build space ships{you only get one per planet}, a research base produces 100 of all the other resourses and 1000 reaserch points, a miner base produces 1000 minerals and 100 of the others, and a Covert Ops center produces 2000 intel point, 500 reaserch and 50 of the others, you get the Idea).

You can them build other terain enhacements that give the other bases a certain %bonus(mines and boreholes increase mineral production, boreholes more than mines, solar panels and echelon mirrors increase radiation and reaserch, echelons more so than solar panels, and farms and condensers do the same for organics production.) Also bunkers, perimiter defense and tachyons fields increase troop defense.

Is there some way to mod the planets so you can build lots of stuff on them without increasing the population?

Secret prodjects are like the system wide bonus buildings, likr the temporal vacation thing and the events predicter.

[EDIT] Also there should be no specific shield tech or laser tech or facility tech, we should mod it so that each tech you research unlocks a new one, just like in the game. I have the tech tree poster all mapped out if you need it.

[ July 04, 2003, 02:35: Message edited by: Hugh Manatee ]

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

true! Planet was nitrogen place, and unfriendly at that... perharps a modded CO2 planet with, like, HARSH environment? or a carefully placed sphereworld... should do it, even if domed http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Thanks Fyron, for pointing me in the direction of your mod tutorial. It looks extremely helpful. Aside from that and SJ's tech gridder, are there any other "must have" modding tools, or "must see" sites?

Welcome aboard Taera! It's great to have you. I like your idea about fungus monsters. Perhaps we could change the Psychic weapons a bit and make them Psionic weapons. They wouldn't capture ships, but they would wipe out the crew (very nasty).

Hugh, those are some great ideas about the facilities and the tech tree. I'm sure we could mod them as you described.

I think we might be able to arrange something about the number of facilities as well. What if we modified the Advanced Storage Techniques trait to 100% instead of 20%, and then made its cost 0 and gave it to all the factions? Then every colony would have twice as many facility slots. I wonder if that would work?

I think at this point we need to figure out how we want to organize ourselves. Do we discuss all of our general ideas first, then work on specifics later? Or, do we jump right in and start modding now, and work out the details as we go along? Do we want a communal style where we all keep our hands in everything, or should we work individually on our specific tasks and report here as needed?

Unless someone else would like to do it, I am willing to act as general coordinator. I will also be able to do a ship set (it took me a year to do my first one - even if it takes me a quarter of the time for set number two, that's still three months), and work on some of the text files to.

Hugh, you wanted to do the Progenitors, which is great. Is there anything else you're interested in (perhaps facilities and research)?

Taera, what would you like to do? I'd love to see what kinds of ship sets you could do for the different factions, but I know you prefer to focus your efforts on the Taera.

Oleg, are you interested in working on the mod as well?

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Adv. Storage techniques would make oxygen planets give you way too much dont you think?

Perharps an e-mail would do us good. How about everyone post their addy and we use that? we can of course use the forum but i find e-mail more.. useful? then again, here we can get instant comments.

WHat will i be doing, hmm. Graphics - im not sure about that one (i'd try the Gaians and perharps University/Consciousness -- which one will we be using? i say Counsciousness, i love those guys http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif ). For now, however, i cant work on images because my PC is dead. I will let you know when that changes, untill then typing and thinking are all i can do http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

I will try to do the progenitor graphics and I would like to attempt to set up a decent tech tree and facilities and components(I was good a this in SE3, lets hope I can handel it.). This is my first time modding and I'll have a lot to learn. I think you(Chronon) should take on the responsibility as coordinator, we should check in here every now and then(at least every other day) and meet once a week and delegate commitee style. While I can do the progenitors shipset, and the tech tree, I don't think I'm up to the challenge of the component and facility pics themselves, this will likely involve photoshopping the stuff from the game and I suck at photoshopping. I'll also need somebody to do the progenitor race pics too. Somebody else can set the actual empire files and AI up.

First we need to get some of this on paper before we start actually modding, otherwise it will all be disorganized. Now like I said I still have the complete tech tree poster, and lots of refferace stuff and at least a hundred hours of SMAC play experience, so I have a few good Ideas. First I think we need to specify the starting point of the game, the Unity captain got wacked and the crew split up into 7(or 12) factions(? we need to decide too if we want to work in the Alien Crossfire factions, I guess we do???) and landed on separate planets instead of 1. We need to decide what techs they start with and how many bases they start with, and define what those techs are. In the game there is actually a dialouge about the difficulty and expense of launching the simplest of space probes, so I assume that in this mod we should assume they put everything up to this point into aeronautics, giving them doctrine Airpower, flexibility, mobility, fossile fuels, and Orbital space flight from the start. this should give them missile weapons, lasers, units like needle jets and satelites, troops and speeders and basic colony ad cargo hulls and a moderate space explorer ship, and the fission reactor(this will be their supply and engines). For facilities, they get the bases I mentioned, but low end ones, which an be upgraded by advancing to the apropriate tech later, and basic terrain enhancements(farm, mines, and solar collectors).As for starting secret prodjects I will have to consult the tech tree and my book. What do you think of my broad outline so far?

[edit]BTW my email is listed up there and it's the same as my IM. I also have a website under construction if we need to use it to host the mod, I didn't really have anything to put on it except the swarm after my old comp crashed. Hugh Manatees Ship Yard, under construction

[ July 04, 2003, 06:54: Message edited by: Hugh Manatee ]

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">You can get the same effect by doubling the number of facilities and such on the planets themselves in PlanetSize.txt. This does not force every empire to require advanced storage technigues.

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

I say we work with SMACX factions because i, personally, find some of them to have much more interesting personalities than some of the original SMAC - for example, my favorite Counsciness is far better than original University.

Agree regarding to tech, Hugh. But how are we going to incorporate Secret Projects?

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Hugh, I agree that we should probably sort out the big issues before we go do our separate tasks. And I'm happy to be the coordinator of the project. I'll try to keep track of everything and keep the "official" mod files here on my computer. I'll also help with the AI modding for the factions (I need to do one for the Verdurans anyway, so I'm learning how to do it now).

Taera, thinking and typing is exactly what we need at the moment. Once we've sorted out the "big picture" perhaps your computer will be back in action and you can work on some of the graphics.

I agree with you, Taera, about some of the SMAX factions being more interesting. How about this group of factions: Angels (intel), Cyborgs (research), Drones (construction, industrialists), Cult (religious and organic), Believers (religious), Pirates (good space combat), and Progenitors (we'll need to make a special racial tech tree for them). We can throw in some neutrals (perhaps from SMAC), and the spaceborne mindworms, too.

Excellent point about planet size, Fyron, I just noticed that Last night when I was skimming your tutorial (very nicely done, btw). So, we won't have to modify AST after all, just the planetsize.txt file.

For the "secret" projects (that always amused me - how could they be secret when everyone knew you were building one?), I like Hugh's idea about making them system facilities. The Network Backbone, for example, would work like the system research facility (I forget what it's called). I always thought the exclusivity of the projects was way too powerful. So, having all races have access (assuming they have the tech) makes sense to me.

Hugh, I like your ideas for beginning techs. I think they should begin on a planet just as usual for SEIV. Also, thanks for volunteering to host the mod on the web.

Since this is a holiday weekend here, and we have family visiting, I probably won't be able to post again until Sunday night. But, I'm sure I'll be thinking about mod ideas all weekend, anyway... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

[ July 04, 2003, 18:23: Message edited by: Chronon ]

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Okay, I'm back in action. I was thinking a little bit more about the tech trees, and how the Progenitors and other factions would work. It would have three main tech trees: 1) Human factions (weapons, shields, facilities, etc.), 2) basic items (colony components, minesweepers, etc.), 3)Progenitor tech. All but the basic items would be racial techs (so humans cannot understand the Progenitor tech and vice versa).

I was thinking that the Progenitor techs would be fewer in number, but more powerful and expensive to research. We'd probably have to be very creative with them, considering there really wasn't much explanation of how all the progenitor stuff worked in the game.

The human ones would be very similar to the SMAC tech tree (as you described them, Hugh), including psionic weapons, ability to develop mindworms, industrial nanorobotics, etc.

I think the main thing we should do is keep the tree pretty simple overall, but interconnected and balanced so one can pursue different strategies and win (just like SMAC). We don't want uber weapons like the PPB, or uber advanced traits like religious.

As far as the images go, I don't think we need to go crazy with the ship sets. We can make a few ourselves, but for the rest we can just use the SMAC faction pictures with some of the standard SEIV ship sets. The only original ones we'll really need are the Progenitors and the mindworms/space monsters. Everything else (Gaians, Pirates, Cyborgs) is just a bonus.

For the other images - Taera do you think we can rip off the component images (missile launcher, laser, etc.) from SMAC? That would be helpful. We'll probably have to make our own facility graphics (although we can probably use many of the standard SEIV ones for that too).

For the speech files, I'll do some mining of the quotes in the game from the various factions, and blend them into to my AIs.

On the whole, I think our philosophy should be to keep it as simple as possible so we actually are able to complete the mod. Let's not make work if we don't have to! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

So, what do you think?

[ July 07, 2003, 02:57: Message edited by: Chronon ]

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Why not use the Image Mod?

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">You can not mod facilities that increase ground troop strength. There is an ability available for it IIRC, but I do not think it actually works.

You will need to have 20 races in the mod. If you have less, you get weird results. Empires will be created with random combinations of ship sets and AIs, and other weird things.

[ July 07, 2003, 09:00: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Try this in the SETTINGS DATA FILE to set number of computer players. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif

Set maximum number of computer players One lower than maximum number of races in mod.
e.g ten races in mod maximum number of computer player nine.

Maximum Computer Player High Setting := 9

It seemed to work no weird results. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

hmm... images shouldnt be a problem.
As for tech tree - you do realize normal races can research Progenitor techs in SMACX do you? (which annoys me at the least). Perharps it could be a ruin tech?

pre-made ships, thats right...
for Nautilus (hate those guys and their ships...) - have you seen the Space Pirates ships? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

TNZ, you will not notice the weird results until you look at the AI empires and see that they are not acting like the correct race.

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Progenitor techs are very well explained in SMACX as they're pretty simple - there are the energy fields existing everywhere (bio-energetic fields, as they're usually called) and the Progenitors are simply able to manipulate these fields to make physical affects.

At least thats how i see it.

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Thanks Fyron, for pointing out the 20 races glitch. Perhaps we can have some of the usual suspects from SEIV fill out the more exotic habitat niches (EEE, for example). The image mod sounds good, too. The less work we have to do, the more likely we are to actually finish this mod.

Taera - You're right that the humans could research some of the Progenitor tech in SMAC, but that doesn't mean we have to do it in our mod. I think we can be creative around the theme, rather than stay strictly within the confines of SMAC. I thought it would be more fun (and realistic?) if the Progenitors had their own tree. That way they would be very different from the other factions in play style. Perhaps a few of their techs could be in the ruins as well - that would be a nice mirror to the ruins on Planet. But, if you feel strongly that we should have one tree with all the techs in it, I can be convinced to do it that way. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

no i dont feel like it, actually i dont like the fact you can research it in SMACX http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif mirror-techs would be very nice. What i mean is progenitor techs put into ruins. But what about progenitors themselves then?

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Yes, I think it would be fun to have one or two of the low level Progenitor techs in ruins for the humans to discover.

As far as the Progenitors themselves, they should have their own facilities and weapons in their tech tree. Some of them we can take directly from SMAC (the Manifolds, Borehole Cluster, Resonance Laser,and Resonance Armor), but we'll need to create much of this ourselves (shields, sensors, resource gathering, research, etc.). Again, I don't think this tree needs to be incredibly intricate, just different (and well balanced with the others).

The other thing I was thinking about was a separate tree for Psionics. Or should we leave it in the main shared tree? If it were a separate racial tech, the Cult, Gaians, and Progenitors would have access, and the others would not (although we might put some generic defense against Psionics - like the empath song - in the shared tree). I'm not sure about this idea. What do you think?

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Just checking in to let you know what I've been working on.

I've spent the Last week trying to figure out how to mod the race style AI for the Verdurans. I have to admit that it has been very difficult (and tedious), and I still don't really know what all the numbers mean in all the text files. Still, by experimentation (and blatant plagiarism), I have managed a generally functional, if not spectacular, AI. I am hoping that this experience will provide the basic foundation for making race styles in the AC Mod.

So, once I'm done with the Verdurans, I'll start getting into the data files for the AC Mod - probably the tech areas first.

PS. Hugh, we haven't heard from you in a while. Are you still interested in doing the tech trees?

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Ok everyone, here's an idea i had - do you remember that in AC the units work by "all or nothing" principle, meaning that a 10% unit is still fully functionable? well, we can implement that by having all components have like 1hp and armor be very strong - but once its beat down.. well... its beat down! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">That would be exactly how Units work in SE IV. Of course, there is still the whole 'stacking' thing to work with. And all the stuff that doesn't work on Units. And the way they don't cost maintainance...

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

well, they do cost maintenance back in SMAC - and with -2 on support you do feel it http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

That's a very interesting idea, Taera. I'm sure we could make it work just as you outlined (or using shields instead). If I remember correctly (is the correct acronym IIRC?), "Mote in God's Eye" by Niven and Pournell had a system where the shields built up energy and if they were overloaded they collapsed, destroying the ship.

I wonder, though, do we really want to do it that way? I would like to use the AC theme as a general basis for the mod, but I would also like it to be a very fun Space Empires game as well. And one of the things that I don't find fun about SEIV is the all or nothing combat (two fleets enter, one fleet leaves almost entirely intact). I would much prefer to see something more evenly balanced. If you have a battle that's roughly equal (5 destroyers versus 5 destroyers) then the results should be pretty devastating on both sides (5 half-destroyed ships on each side, or 3 completely destroyed ships and 2 badly damaged ones). That's why I would prefer to have leaky shields and leaky armor, less potent training facilities (or none at all), and less potent ECM and Combat sensors (perhaps 1% or 2% per level instead of 10%). Of course, I am always willing to be persuaded otherwise... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

PS. Another thing I don't like is mines (the AI can't deal with them, and human players easily overcome them), which I would like to eliminate entirely.

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

OK Chronon, i agree with you - its the theme thats important, not the game system. My bad, got confused for a moment http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

p.s here's a thought - how we gonna put abilities for units? i mean, ECM, Deep Radar, etc.

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yes. Just give me a little time to read some of the SE4 mod tutorials and such and finish a couple of other pet prodjects of mine and I'm all for it.

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">1 or 2 percent is meaningless. All you are doing there is forcing a lot of pointless research on the players to get to something useful. 5% per level makes a difference in combat, but not a huge one. It is where the bonuses max out that is the bigger issue.

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

I also have an Idea, to stay true to SMAC, I think we should make shields a highly advanced tech that comes along in late game. I think we should just have different kinds of armors and such that have different special abilities(like regenerating and partial regenerating shielding for "resonance" armor, ecm, that sort of thing)until then.

What do you think of having mindworms be troops, "spacelurks"(sealurks in space) be like battle cruisers , Ilse of the Deep be Carriers, and Locusts of Chiron be like drones(uncontrollable but deadly). Also we could make spore launches like satellites or weapons platforms and Fungal towers the same.

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Hugh: Great ideas! I agree that shields should be a more advanced tech, and I like your ideas about various special abilities on the armors and the abilities of the mindworms, etc. No problem about taking your time on the tech trees. I'm still working on the Verduran AI, and then I'll need to do a little re-texturing for the ships as well (Thanks again, Taera). So, it will probably be a couple of weeks before I can jump in to the AC Mod.

Fyron: I'm curious, how are you approaching the issue of combat sensors and ecm in the Adamant mod? I'd love to hear your thoughts on how to make the combat results less one-sided.

Taera: On the units, I'm pretty sure that we can mod things like ecm, soporific gas pods, etc, to be part of the regular tech tree, and make them "small." Just like shields and armor work in standard SEIV - there are ship-sized and unit-sized Versions.

On a related note, I was thinking some more about planet sizes, and I think we should make oxygen rock planets larger (perhaps double: 10, 20, 30, 40, 50 facilities), give them all ice planet colonization at the beginning (they're just very cold rock planets - but I think the oxygen ones should be the same size as domed because it's very difficult to build a good-sized colony there) and not have gas giant colonization technology at all (I always thought this was a real stretch for humanoid life forms).

Since ALL of the factions will need an oxygen atmosphere (even the worms and Progenitors), this will create intense competition for oxygen rock worlds, with all the other rock and ice planets being domed, leaving the gas giants and asteroids for orbital facilities and resource extraction (using the space equivalent of crawlers - which should be much more useful than they are in SEIV). The larger size of the "homeworlds" will also make ground combat and weapons platforms much more important. I always thought it was unrealistic that one escort with a missle can wipe out an entire world (as it works in standard SEIV).

So, what do you think?

PS. I imagine we can create some new planet images (Capt. Kwok's Skool of Planet design, anyone?) to look more like Planet, with red land masses instead of green.

PPS. I also don't think we should have a stellar manipulation tech area. Destroying worlds, creating stars, etc., is way beyond AC technology. Solar panels could be part of the supply tree, and I think solar sails should be more of an emergency propulsion option for when the main engines are dead (they're really only good for in-system flight, and they're very, very slow).

[ July 17, 2003, 17:25: Message edited by: Chronon ]

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Well, leaky armor and shields insures that the victor will come away with a lot of crippled ships (and might not even destroy all of the enemy ships in one comabt anyways, esp. with use of Structural Supports (0 kT comps with 2-6 HPs) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif ). I have made the standard weapon fire rate be 2 instead of 1. Combat Sensors start at 10% and rise to 35% over 6 levels (5% per level). ECM goes from 5% to 30% over 6 levels. Ship training is 1% per turn with a max of 10%. Fleet training is 1% per turn to a max of 5%. All training is system-wide, to eliminate moon stacking. Racial combat characteristics (agg and def) are expensive and can only range from 90 to 110. Cultural combat bonuses are reduced. The best is still Berzerkers, but it only gives +5% instead of +10%. Long Range Scanners give between 2% and 15% to hit bonus, so there is more you can do to get to hit bonuses. All ships have built in ECM modifiers, from high bonuses with tiny ships to high penalties with huge ships. Engines give small ECM bonuses, which get better with each engine class. Mounts are completely changed, so there are no scale mounts. The only one that increases damage done does x1.5 damage, but x2 size. It is not meant to make your ship more powerful, but for use against heavy defenses that need lots of damage per shot. Other mounts included range increasing, accuracy increasing, reinforced mounts, etc. They all have tradeoffs (often high cost, less damage, more supplies used, that sort of stuff). There is no mount that it is always better to be using.

Now, I am not sure what the overall net effect will be because I have not done much testing yet. But, that is what the Beta phase is for. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[ July 17, 2003, 19:24: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

actually Progenitors actually breathe nitrogen [edit-and so do native lifeforms - after all they're native to a nitrogen world] - notice they're not wearing atmospheric masks, if you realy want start a new game and go meet aliens - you'll get the visual decription of alien infantry in the text.

[ July 18, 2003, 00:44: Message edited by: Taera ]

Re: Alpha Centauri Mod Discussion Thread
 

Thanks alot Fyron, for your thoughts on combat balance. All of those sound like great ideas, and we may want to adopt many of them here. I'll be curious to see how they work in your beta testing.

Taera: Hmm...if the Progenitors and mindworms actually breathe the nitrogen, then the would be able to live on CO2 worlds as well. Balance-wise, that might actually work out very well, because the Progenitors would have a huge advantage over everyone else. They could create lots of problems for the human player. Of course, it means if a human decides to play the Progenitors, the game would be extremely easy, but that's the way it is in AC, too.