[Fyron]

Originally posted by Mephisto:

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Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:

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First, you keep making a claim without any support material, while others are telling you you are wrong and using support material.

No, they do not have support material. I have seen them post no supporting material.

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And neither are you, Fyron.
Science and education were preserved in the Church during the EDA in the monasteries. Without the sanctuary of the monasteries and Church buildings most if not all of the ancient wisdoms from the Greeks and Romans would have been destroyed. And, finally, don't just forget the worldly rulers. Do you think they had any interest in educating the pawns, their minions?

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I think you people have misunderstood me. I never once said nor implied that the Church was the only factor. Of course other things were influences. What I said was that the Curch stifled new advancements. Of course the monastaries preserved old documents. I never once said they did not, or said anything that is affected by that fact. You do not get new advancements simply by preserving ancient texts. After the facts began overwhelming the Church's dogma, these texts were used to restore long lost knowledge. But, this still is not qualified as a new advancement.

Fyron - I thought that I did provide plenty of supporting examples on my points. Could you be more specific on the types of evidence you would like to see?

My point was that you did not cite any sources for your claims, which some people seem to think is only a problem when I make Posts.

Narrew and Fyron - I won't argue that the world view of the Middle Ages seems somewhat limited from our modern perspective. But as Kwok has argued, the reasons for this go beyond the Church. Are you arguing that without the Church there would have arisen a kind of spontaneous Scientific Revolution?

No, I am arguing that the Church's actions of clinging to old (false) beliefs about the nature of the world prolonged the European Dark Ages because questioning the Church was heresy. How can you come up with new ideas when you are branded as a heretic for doing so? If the Catholic Church was not there, there would have been a different Church that would have done just about the same exact thing.

It would be a dream to think knowledge was transmitted in the population.

Of course it would. I have not seen anyone argue this so far.