[geoschmo]

Originally posted by Grandpa Kim:
And therein lies the truth about "team" victories. I have never seen a partnership where the partners are reasonably equal in strength. One member always seem to be way out in front of the rest, and he is the true victor. Even though its never stated, everyone knows this and its just the BMOC being gracious (and he probably has a monster empire that is a b**** to manage and doesn't want to go through the laborious end game.

You hit the nail on the head here Gpa. The problem as I see it is by giving the little hangers on the title of co-winner you elminate the incentive for them to eventually band together and take out the BMOC, or die trying. This severly limits the oppotunities for REAL diplomacy in the game. I don't consider the "Yes boss, whatever you say boss." stuff that goes on between the big guy and his lackeys as diplomacy.

While you say even though it's never stated everybody knows who the winner is, I honestly feel if it were stated openly the BMOC would have a much harder time recruiting his minions and keeping them loyal. Compare these two statements:

"Join me in a powerful alliance. We will defeat the other empires and rule the galaxy together."

or

"Join me in a powerful alliance. You will help me to defeat the other empires and I will rule the galaxy. As long as you don't go agasint me I won't destroy you and I will always know your assistance was an important part of my success and will think highly of you for it."

You might still get a few to join with the second, more honest statement, but likely not as many.

And the other question is would the BMOC have gotten as big as he did without the early absolute alliances and complete tech trading that goes on with the understanding of a team victory? Maybe, but it's doubtful in most cases.

Geoschmo