[grumbler]

SJ: Yes, I agree that the younger races should find it difficult to take out the Ancients, but the way things are now writtent the Shadows and Vorlons simply have too great an ability AT THE START OF THE GAME. In the game I am currentluy playing to test EA stuff, the Vorlons have kept the Centauri to one planet for 200 turns, using 5 ships total. the Centauri started two systems away from the Vorlons and they have been at war since turn 10 or so. Even Centauri cruisers are getting whacked by Vorlon escorts.

I think the secret to making the Ancients "unbeatable" may be in making their planetary defenses much better, even early, and their ships not quite so effective. In fact, just by changing the shadow weapons to fire once per two turns, the battle outcomes become more like what we want. The EA just finally managed to keep the Shadows from taking a planet (after they had burned off 3 others, never even attempting an invasion) by closing in to short range with half the fleet (armed with particles cannons) and standing off with half lobbing in shells. The losses were almost 2-1 in favor of the shadows, and the strength ratio about 2-1 in favor of the EA.

The problem with the shadows is that they kill a ship per turn, pretty much, even when they are small ships. Plus, with their edge in required tonnage and better engines, they have lots more room for armor, and are tougher to boot. Having a Shadow vessel be worth twice the value of a younger races ship is fine, but the shadows are too tough early on. They distort the game by whom they are placed near.

PF: I am now setting up some scenarios where I will just fight similar ships with minor differences in the "simulator" to see if some empirical rules are exposed. maybe that will give us some places to start.

TS: I like the idea of just getting the weapons for each race listed. Certainly, if there are obviously inferior weapons that no one will use because there are better options available, then we can get rid of them or at least restrict them so the AI doesn't have to sort through them.

Is it possible to get this weapoins spreadsheet that people are discussing? IF, did I understand that you had one?