View Single Post
  #25  
Old August 24th, 2006, 10:00 PM

vic vic is offline
Private
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 23
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
vic is on a distinguished road
Default Re: Infantry Casualties at 50m

superb analysis...IMHO infantry lethality, particularly at shorter ranges, has always (i.e. even the DOS version) been WAY over the top. the whole move close, get massacred, bounce without shooting back routine has always, for me, detracted from the game. even in urban environments it is impossible for opposing units to remain adjacent to one another for more than a turn or two as one or the other will surely be routed or destroyed.

WWII infantry advancing slowly/carefully while in cover (e.g. urban environment) isn't the same as napoleonic era troops marching shoulder-to-shoulder up to the muzzles of the enemies guns. one of the reasons SPWW2 squads draw so many casualties is that, apparently, the entire population of the squad is considered as being "available" as a target in covered terrain. in fact, squads would advance slowly by individuals (e.g. point man) and/or small teams by alteranting movement with staionary periods providing for cover of movement of others.

rifle fire, particularly the bolt-action type, effectiveness in SPWW2 is murderous beyond belief. the bolt action rifle's major role was to provide a sense of "self-defense comfort" to the bearer and be a noisemaker and marginal suppressor of fire. producing casualties at the SPWW2 rate during WWII would have seen the war over in 1940 as all combatants would have exhausted all available manpower resources quickly.

couple this with your excellent observation on movement and fire in SPWW2 (move one at a time against "all units in range" opfire) and squads get shredded rapidly and fire not a shot in reply.

i ran exhaustive tests, even reducing rifle range to a more practical 7 hexes (that being effective range, not the spec for ammo max range) and even reducing HE kill to 0. it helped some but at range 1 it was still incredibly bloody.

my conclusions:
1. rifle fire is IN GENERAL 4-5 times too lethal (i.e. needs to be reduced by roughly 65-75%) and
2. at range 1 it is about 10 times too lethal (i.e. needs to be reduced by about 90%).
3. units encountering enemy at range 1 should ALWAYS return fire at least once before "bouncing" if forced to retreat (i.e. move adjacent, take fire, give fire, retreat.) fire for the moving unit in this situation should be calculated BEFORE deducting casualty losses caused by the initial defender "volley".
4. moving infantry unit casualties from direct fire should be restricted when moving adjacent to stationary enemy infantry units according to speed:
a. moving slowly, only 20% of squad personnel can be casualties
b. moving 40%
c. moving fast 80%

so a 12 man squad moving slowly in heavy cover adjacent to a defending squad could lose NO MORE than 12x 20% or 2.4 casualties.

all other conditions equal, opposing squads on adjacent hexes in cover in "one-on-one" situations should be able to hold postion and fire on their opposition for a number of turns without retreating or suffering crippling losses.

with both sides having similar manpower levels, in cover, motionless and dishing out about as much suppression as they get casualties would be low. one might get the occasional grenade casualty but that would be it. forcing the issue would require more manpower/firepower to tip the balance in favor of the stronger party.

best,
vic
Reply With Quote