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pdoktar said:
Well, as I said I know how 9x19, 7,62x39 and 7,62x54 acts, when fired full auto. I have no personal experience of .45ACP. However here is a good thread about WW2 SMGs and their uses in different armies, by guys who know or have fired those guns, maybe not in WW2 but later.
Presenting again our beloved tanknet: http://63.99.108.76/forums/index.php...hinegun&st=120
And from personal experince I can guarantee that the Suomi SMG 9x19 was very easy to handle with 6-9 round automatic bursts and regularly landed on target with surprising accuracy, that can not be said from same distance with an AK or finnish M62 7,62x39 on similar full auto bursts.
Also consider this: if you drop one SMG range to 2hexes from three, there will be twenty guys complaining from different reasons that why this gun outranges the other, and have about million arguments why it actually should be the other way round. The developers would probably like to see to drop individual weapon designations and use only a generic SMG, rifle or self-loading rifle or carbine. However this will not happen, because there would be again ten oob makers saying that they want to present their Thompson, M16 or whatever for some reason (reality) to the game, so the individual weapon names will stand.
If you drop all SMGs to range 1hex, SMG-armed formations will suffer heavily. They will be gunned down from 2+ hex range by any regular rifle squad and will be mostly useless in this game system. My opinion comes from 5 years of gaming experience with SPWW2 / SPMBT system.
edited for spelling
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Can't really compare a submachinegun cartridge (aka a PISTOL cartridge) performance with an assault rifle (7.62X39) or full size rifle (7.62X54R). An assault rifle mainly uses full auto fire for close combat where the targets are densely located and not under heavy cover. A full size battle rifle, say an FN/FAL, using a full power 7.62 NATO cartridge is USELESS in full auto. After the first shot the weapon rapidly climbs to where by the third shot you are shooting at birds.
On full auto an AK is range-restricted simply because of the increased recoil (due to increased power AND lethality) of the round. A 7.62X54R is a rifle or medium machinegun cartridge and has FAR more recoil. Yes, a 9MM in a heavy submachinegun is controllable. But you are NOT going to get "rifle-like" accuracy out of it. The barrel is way too short (usually around 10 inches) and the smaller length, even with a folding stock extended, simply doesn't lend itself to good accuracy potential. I would imagine a whole platoon armed with submachineguns and firing them like mortars is going to cause the enemy to immediately take cover. But if they are firing those submachineguns from a range so far away that they aren't coming close to the people they are shooting at, then they are in for some bad mojo in the form of artillery fire.
Will submachingun formations suffer if I drop it to one hex...most definitely. But that's a lot closer to reality than giving them long range killing power via some mortar-like firing of their weapons. I doubt very much any submachinegun users fired their weapons at long rifle ranges (over 100 meters) in real life anyway. Not unless they were suicidal and wanted to give their positions away. It's the same thing as having an M4 Sherman fire at it's maximum range at a Tiger tank and then expect it to survive the encounter when the Tiger can far outrange and outpower it. I am simply forcing the submachinegun units to be used as they were intended to be used in real life. If I am taking away some amazingly unrealistic abilities and advantages, then so be it. Those formations will just have to deal with it
I will use submachinegun units in urban or heavily forested combat where they won't be instantly visible. They will just have to use stealth to accomplish their mission instead of depending on an unrelistic advantage from their weapons.
If you REALLY want to know how the Thompson fires, I suggest you head over to the location where people who still own and shoot them post...
http://www.machinegunbooks.com/forum...hp?showforum=3
Dep