[cbo]

Originally Posted by Cross

I guess we have to remember that this is only a game that attempts to simulate certain aspects of warfare. With that in mind, we can legalistically adhere to accurate historical ammo loadouts and actually make the game less realistic.

In principle, yes, with regards to ammo loadouts, I disagree.
Seems to me that some players are simply understanding war like the British pre-1914 General Staff, that got caught with their pants down when faced with the ammo expenditure of modern war. Of course, their German 1939 counterparts made the same mistake, resulting in the German Army running into ammo shortages early in WW2.

Modern war revolves around firepower and I think the game reflects that quite well.

Realistically, Infantry/MG ammo should be a concern for many scenarios and types of battles. Perhaps for an average battle (not 'infantry slugfests') ammo should only become an issue for the platoon/s that was the most engaged. Currently, this is not the case.

....

An ammo reduction wouldn't be only to reduce z-fire over-use, but also to make ammo conservation (for infantry) a more common issue on the SPWW2 battlefield.

With a nod to Mareks comment, how often did WWII infantry run out of small arms ammunition in combat? Is it really something that occured on a regular basis in battles rarely lasting more than an hour - about the max. length of SPWW2 battles?

From reading, I can recall it happening for units cut off from supply, fighting for hours and even days or when facing an exceptionally target rich enviroment as Marek pointed out. But normally, during an average battle of rather short duration?

Perhaps comming up with some historical examples would help make the case and convince us sceptics

Ideally we would have some sort of slider button to adjust ammo loadouts for certain unit classes. It would be nice to have the choice to adjust ammo levels according to preferance/ scenario.

I'm sure we would all welcome more preference options to fit our particular interpretations of WWII warfare, but on the other hand, there are quite a few already and I rarely use any of them.

In practical terms, it really isn't unit classes which should have their ammo loads reduced, but weapon types. Reducing the ammo load of an infantry unit would also reduce the number of handgrenades, anti-tank rifle ammo, panzerfausts or light mortar ammo.
To achieve the desired effect, the only small arms and MG ammo loads should be adjusted. But even that would be difficult, as weapon classes are not really precise enought for this. For example, class 2, secondary weapons include both LMGs and handgrenades and class 3, team weapons, include both mortars and machineguns.

Even if one considered a preference for adjusting ammo loads desirable, I'm at a loss to see how it could reasonably be implemented in the game?

The over-use of artillery is often and easily avoided by a pre-game agreement that limits arty to 10-15% of buy points.
There must be a similar (practical) way to limit z-fire, but I haven't thought of it yet.

I agree with Blitzkreigs post that z-fire is realistic, and should not be turned off, but it negatively effects gameplay when it's overused

I'm sure those who "overuse" Z-fire do not think that they "overuse" anything. And this is, it seems to me, the core of the matter: That people just play the game differently. And if there are players with whom you cannot agree on how it is to be played - dont play with them.
It seems to me that most people agree that Z-fire is a realistic tactic whether it is used to simulate recon by fire or suppression by un-aimed fire.
The real "problems" seem only related to that fact that it is "boring" to watch and make replays take too long. And it is only so, it seems to me, because it results in a lot of firing - which is not in itself unrealistic.

(btw, couldn't you just reduce message delay and animation to make replays shorter?)

Anyway, it is up to the powers that be to adress it, if they think it is an issue. I just want to make that argument why I dont see it as an issue at all.

cbo