Quote:
Originally Posted by WraithLord
Well nations like TNN/Van would need two things post 1.7:
A. Adapt to different play style. Thugs are economically good for PD raiding. For anything more than that the player would need to pay much more hence tough decisions. So with thugs getting minor role post 1.7 a nation like TNN would have less reasons to take ubber bless and more reasons to take a more diverse pretender + better scales, I'm not sure it's that bad but it ain't enough so:
B. Some form of compensation would be required for such nations. Maybe buff their recruit-able thugs a bit, maybe more starting gems, maybe better starting equipment on thugs.
Like give TNN thugs a frost brand and make them cost 100g more.
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At the moment glamoured thugs can do more than just PD raiding. Properly equipped they can take down SCs. At the same time, they are fragile. A single casting of drain life will waste the investment in them. And fighting a nation like Jotun late game they suffer a horribly high attrition rate between flying, magic attack blood summons and skratti's casting life for a life or claws of kokytos or just killing them in melee (aside from the usual counters like mind hunt).
I'd be pretty sad to have my favorite part of the game resigned to raiding PD due to increase in forging costs and nerf to brands (in particular the non-AP frost brand).
As far adapting to a different play style, one of the big advantages Van has over TNN, and especially Eriu, is that they have other options. Obviously one of those options, blood magic, took a big hit with 1.7. But assuming a dousing bonus is in the works that would still be viable. But I'm not sure what Eriu can adapt to. Sure, they can go for great scales but I don't see that as being a winning proposition against other nations that favor good scales but also have excellent troops, cost effective researchers, good non-cap mages, access to D/S/B, etc. What they've got is their thugs. I think in this case you really need to add some more options to the nation. Reducing the thugging potential of the nation without providing alternatives is painful. Note: Zeldor mentioned things already being in the works so perhaps this is already being addressed.
Also, I think one reason to replace built-in gear with forged gear is so that a casting of destruction/iron bane doesn't ruin your thug's day. Assuming a built-in frost brand was susceptible to those spells (haven't tested it) I wouldn't want to pay 100 more for an already expensive 280 gold unit.
Lastly, rdonj mentioned he expected to see more thugs relative to SCs. It's an interesting question (I'd expect the opposite) but aside from the ratio of thugs to SCs it seems reasonable to assume the absolute number of both will decrease. Given that, I think it's reasonable to increase the cost of mind hunt from 2 to 3 gems (don't have the game in front of me so if that's already the cost in 1.7 then ignore that suggestion).