Current game effects of thermobaric ammo

[Suhiir]

Originally Posted by Mobhack

The 999 code is the indication that it is a flame weapon, and should use the special flame penetration rules is all.

Cheers
Andy

Originally Posted by DRG

"Napalm" as a weapon class behaves differently than HE and has geater effects on kill and supression.

The weapon is already given a 45 HEK rating which is over twice the rating of a 152mm shell and every increase in WH size increases the overall affect in the game and ONE of those effects is the spillover effect on surrouding hexes. As you noted that warhead is 93 MM. Hardly very large, it's just over 3 1/2 inches. It would hardy have an effect on the target hex AND every hex around it which is what happens if that is boosted to a WH5 and that's why it has a WH 3.

Let's look at that from the "football/soccer" field perspective. The RPO now has a serious affect on one 50x50 metre hex. Increasing that WH size to 5 gives it an effect on the target hex 50 square metres but on the six hexes surrounding it. A standard football/soccer ranges in size from 50 to 100 yards wide by 100 to 130 yards long. At 50x100 that's the equivalent of 2 game hexes so increasing the WH size to 5 would give the RPO an effect on an area 3 and a half times that area and the RPO simply does not have the power to effect that great an area.


Don

Originally Posted by Marek_Tucan

AFAIK the random number up to Warhead Size parameter is being added to HEAT penetration rating upon impact (note sometimes the HEAT pen is also degraded, sometimes really significantly)...

I've been considering the current game effects of Thermobaric (FAE) ammo.
In "reality" FAE's are just big explosions in small packages not incendiary weapons. Currently the 40mm FAE is classified 8-Infantry Flame, the SMAW-NE as 18-Napalm, and the CBU Incendiary as 18-Napalm.
All of these weapons create a burning hex in addition to their damage effects.

Would it be "more accurate" to use the 999 AP Pen code for them?

Or possibly rate them more like a satchel charge with a smaller Warhead size (3 or 4) so they don't supress surrounding hexes?

Discussion?

[Mobhack]

there is no 999 ap code. That is the reported penetration value for flame weapons generated internally by the code.

Flamethrower type weapons suit as thermobarics best in the Sp engine.

Andy

[Suhiir]

Originally Posted by Mobhack

there is no 999 ap code. That is the reported penetration value for flame weapons generated internally by the code.

Flamethrower type weapons suit as thermobarics best in the Sp engine.

Andy

Thanks.

[Wdll]

BTW, if you want to have some fun with the, get the russian mlrs that fires them. Shoot near enemy armour. Laughter. I found out about it in a recent game. Way overpowered.

[Imp]

Originally Posted by Wdll

BTW, if you want to have some fun with the, get the russian mlrs that fires them. Shoot near enemy armour. Laughter. I found out about it in a recent game. Way overpowered.

Off topic a bit but in what way pressume talking TOS-1s here. They are great for taking out entire Mech Co or infantry but vs armour not really enough punch to kill, have had them dirrect fired at my armour to in desperation. Taking advantage of any suppresion can be tricky to as a couple of flame hexes can stop TI seeing through. As a note makes them handy tools as an attacker in river crossings due to this.

[DRG]

Originally Posted by Wdll

BTW, if you want to have some fun with the, get the russian mlrs that fires them. Shoot near enemy armour. Laughter. I found out about it in a recent game. Way overpowered.

The Tos graphics currently don't do the weapon justice because the weapon class is 9 whereas it should be 18 ( and is now ) like any other flame rocket and is an exceedingly nasty fuel-air weapon that fires a salvo of 30 missiles in anywhere from 7.5 -15 seconds depending on the source.

......" it fires a 220mm fuel-air explosive missile. This type of munition releases a large cloud of flammable gas and cause massive explosions that can clear out bunkers and other fortifications. "

......"it detonates, first creating a high temperature cloud of flame followed by a crushing overpressure."

It wouldn't do tanks any good either and it's already a very expensive weapon that's twice the cost of CM rockets

If you want to criticize the weapon stats, that's fine, but try doing it with actual data if you think it's "Way overpowered"


Don

[Wdll]

Originally Posted by DRG

The Tos graphics currently don't do the weapon justice because the weapon class is 9 whereas it should be 18 ( and is now ) like any other flame rocket and is an exceedingly nasty fuel-air weapon that fires a salvo of 30 missiles in anywhere from 7.5 -15 seconds depending on the source.

It wouldn't do tanks any good either and it's already a very expensive weapon that's twice the cost of CM rockets

If you want to criticize the weapon stats, that's fine, but try doing it with actual data if you think it's "Way overpowered"


Don

It feels overpowered to me (and my opponent) the way a single shot from a weapon would feel if it would take out (as in 100% destroy) 4 Merkava 4s in one hit.
I have zero knowledge about the specific weapon so I do not comment on if it is overpowered in terms of not good translation reality--->game. So, I am not criticizing the way it is implemented in the game.

That doesn't change what I think about CM in the game, but that is a different matter so no point in talking about here I guess.

[Imp]

It feels overpowered to me (and my opponent) the way a single shot from a weapon would feel if it would take out (as in 100% destroy) 4 Merkava 4s in one hit.

As I said think you were lucky it will flaten IFVs 95% of the time but vs tanks nowhere near that effective, unharmed or light damage with heavy suppresion is common vs a MBT in my experience. Vs troops if anything might be more effective due to blanket effect, even if found cover somehow from the heat I would think there is no oxygen left to breath which is probably terminal.
Kartoffel worth a look at them in action on you tube, the old Tungunaska is a good view to. Also try typing in power sliding/drifting tanks or some such. Some great vids of guys messing on snow ice in MBT IFVs 60 Tons going sideways at 30 miles an hour is a bit mad, wonder what the battle computer would make of it.

[Wdll]

Well, I am sure one of my opponents will have a different opinion on the matter after a single hit destroyed 4 Merkava 4s which were parked on the same hex.

[Imp]

Well I would say someone smiled on you, only has 20 odd CM rating not the fairly standard 60, it will however probably have a greater variety of results as its a flame weapon.
I may have been unlucky with but find regular CM better vs tanks, mind you cant say I have come across anyone kind enough to park 4 tanks in 1 hex bet the richochets went on for a bit unless you had fast arty on