Carriers/(Don't Get Hurt) in Strategic Combat

[Aristoi]

I'm curious if anyone knows a way around this, but when I'm in strategic combat, my carriers seem to have the worst possible pathing. It appears that the "Don't get hurt" order just means randomly pick a corner and go to it.

I have seen carriers fly directly towards an enemy ship in front of all its fighters, and be destroyed, all because it wants to "flee" to a corner that be beyond the enemy. This is really crazy, and I hope that MM will tweak the AI so that it takes into consideration enemy craft when using "Don't Get Hurt."

Has anyone else seen this behavior?

[dogscoff]

This is just the "don't get hurt" strategy all over. I avoid it all costs. Basically, your only options are "fight" or "die", so try one of the following:

-give your carrier long range wepaons and set tactic to "maximum weapons range". Tell it to target the nearest ship and it should keep a good distance from enemy ships. It won't take any notice of fighters though. Also no good if the enemy has longer range weapons than you.

-Set tactic to "Ram". If it has plenty of fighter support and some armour (organic is best=-) then it might well survive in a fighter battle. Note that strategic will only obey the ram tactic
if your ship has no weapons (except PDCs).

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"Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering?"
"Uh, I think so, Brain, but balancing a family and a career ... oooh, it's all too much for me. "

[dogscoff]

<LIGHT BULB>

I've just had a fantastic idea...

</LIGHT BULB>

Would it be possible to mod the following weapon:
-No/ low tonnage
-No/ low cost
-Direct fire
-Immediate reload
-Long range. Optimal value would have to be worked out by trial and error, perhaps increasing with tech to give better performances against higher- tech weapons.
-No supply usage
-Target ships, planets, fighters, sats, seekers
-I know zero damage is impossible so 1 damage at all ranges and a 1% chance of hitting.
-Available at start of game with no research needed. (attached to engines tech tree?)
-Max 1 per ship
-Available for ships only.

This weapon could be added to unarmed ships like colony ships, transports etc. The ship in question could then use "Max weapons range/ target nearest" to maintain a safe distance from attackers. If you get the range right this might work better than the "Don't get hurt/ Die like a dog in a pirhana pool" strategy.

Would this work? If you wanted you could explain it away with something like "The crew of the ship desperatly modify the engines to inflict tiny amounts of damage on an attacking ship"

Thoughts?

------------------
"Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering?"
"Uh, I think so, Brain, but balancing a family and a career ... oooh, it's all too much for me. "

[This message has been edited by dogscoff (edited 07 June 2001).]

[Aristoi]

That idea has merit. It's brassy, it's sassy, it's a musical humdinger! It would be a good way to take the fix into our own hands. Since it has no offensive worth, why not just make it a single component available at the start of the game ot all with a massive range?

Hopefully, MM will work on this soon and squash this bug.

[Arc.Smiloid]

I play the DevNullMod and I always add sprint missiles and anti-fighter missiles to my carriers (Both are real long-range weapons). With appropriate strategy they maintain good distance and fire their weapons.

The sprint missiles are excellent for soaking up enemy PD which protects my fighters. The Anti-Fighter missiles knock out enemy fighter wings with ease giving my fighters excellent support.

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[PurpleRhino]

Love the 'nul' weapon idea... but one thing. You would have to have the range maxed out... otherwise it would fly towards a Base or missile ship... possible putting it in range... Especially if its a high level plasma missile. Granted, everything has its flaws, but I think that could be better than what we have now. Another thing I just thought of is that you would have to change the strategy of EVERY ship that defaults to 'don't get hurt' to Max. Range, upon creation and design upgrades... not THAT big of a deal, but annoying none the less.

[geoschmo]

Carriers need a "Stay out of range of enemy weapons" strategy. That shouldn't be too difficult to code. Instead of running for the hills, it would just stay a couple squares outside the longest range weapon an enemy has available. It could loiter there launching fighters, and then retreat if an enemy approaches it.

Geo

[Jubala]

quote:

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Originally posted by geoschmo:
Carriers need a "Stay out of range of enemy weapons" strategy. That shouldn't be too difficult to code. Instead of running for the hills, it would just stay a couple squares outside the longest range weapon an enemy has available. It could loiter there launching fighters, and then retreat if an enemy approaches it.

Geo

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A good idea, but the ship would have to stay out of range of not only the longest ranged weapon the enemy has but also the combat move of the ship with that weapon. Otherwise said enemy ship could move towards your ship and still be able to shoot at it.

[geoschmo]

True. And there are other ways it could be damaged. By being outflanked etc. But I think it would be an acceptable risk if it would allow the carrier to launch its fighters in a more concentrated manner.

Especially since fighters in SEIV don't die if the carrier does. They would be stranded in that system, but they could be used as raiders until another carrier could pick them up.

Geo

[capnq]

In some of my games I've added a new strategy for carriers called "Fighter Support"; I think I use Maximum Range for primary move and Optimal Range for secondary move. I only use Don't Get Hurt for unarmed ships and ships designed for support roles.

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Cap'n Q

The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the
human mind to correlate all of its contents. We live on a placid
island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of infinity, and it was
not meant that we should go far. -- HP Lovecraft, "The Call of Cthulhu"