Ulm vs New Era

[Sandman]

Seems a little unfair; drain-immune should mean drain-immune!

Heh, without the ability to build any research enhancing tools. NE *needs* Magic of some level or another in order to make it's Dryad's cost/research bearable. While saying, "I can always get sages" this doesn't change that everyone else can get sages and you are in no better a position than you were before.

Cataphracts are vastly superior to Black Knights and thus NE has a distinct advantage over Ulm. Also another consideration is that Minotaurs and a goodly portion of the Satyrs (except for the Hoplite) are strat move 2. Both suffer from the same condition of non-random mages, but Pans have N3E2 and a significant Nature Income (which allows early or high powered Mother Oak/Gift of Health enchantments) and use of Horn of Valor/Supply items.

The comparison of Missile Troops is pretty moot, since NE doesn't have any missile troops and Ulm has high resource Missile Troops (the draw to missile troops is masses not really quality) and Missile weapons are nulled very early in the game with spells and magic items.

The Grove Guard is not really pro/con in the NEvUlm debate, mostly because the Grove Guard is in and of itself, not worth building with the Mino Soldiers right next to them.

The ability to stealth preach is also a big factor between the two.

I prefer NE.

[Vicious Love]

They're smiths, not battle mages. They have no business leaving the kitchen, except to cast Legions of Steel and get back to the forge.

[PrinzMegaherz]

Originally posted by Zen:

The Grove Guard is not really pro/con in the NEvUlm debate, mostly because the Grove Guard is in and of itself, not worth building with the Mino Soldiers right next to them.

What are the advantages of the normal Minotaures except the strategic move of 2?

[Boron]

hm i think ulm is still better . and with spies you can give pan ne who needs national troops nice trouble .

ulm really shines in forging . when you chose a wise magic path on your pretender he can summon good scs and your smith forge all the toys for them .

[PrinzMegaherz]

Originally posted by Boron:
ulm really shines in forging . when you chose a wise magic path on your pretender he can summon good scs and your smith forge all the toys for them

Is that so? Do you empower your smiths to do the forging? Or do you only use Fire Earth items? Imho you can't have a midgame SC without Death and Astral (Wraith Sword and Amulett of Luck)

Nature magic allows you to get most other paths trough the lamia queen, and the harpy queen gives you air magic. I think thats pretty versatile for a nation that is supposed to have bad magic.

[Demosthenes]

Originally posted by Vicious Love:
They're smiths, not battle mages. They have no business leaving the kitchen, except to cast Legions of Steel and get back to the forge.

Early on, a couple of artillery Smiths casting Magma Bolts from the rear can really make a difference for Ulm.