Mod Dominions 3000 v0.81 - lots of new indies, new map (using the brand new map commands)

Aezeal · #1 January 2nd, 2009, 06:12 PM

I've released 0.76, it's not much changed, only added the arena reward and lowered the ulm farsummon a bit.

I did it mostly since there where multiple 0.75 versions and that would not be a good idea for MP I think, now everyone will have to play with this one

I'm creating a MP thread in the MP forum now.. all regulars in here are welcome sign up. I'll take R'lyeh since it was said to be the weakest nation.

Loren · #2 January 2nd, 2009, 08:45 PM

Ok, an observation on the correct map:

My gripes about being pinned by water are gone.

In SP at least I find the dragons unplayable on this map. My victories in a more normal game have always been based on being able to pin his armies with assassins.

Against the races of this map that doesn't work as well and it's moot anyway--the battle is at knife-fighting range, there's no space to use the strategy that works.

I won an early war that Ulm picked but then I was approaching the limits of what my income could support. The game dissolved into being pecked away at by a combination of Jomon and Ry'leh and there was simply nothing to do about it. I could maintain only two fighting forces and that realistically gave me two provinces and a severe negative cashflow. Furthermore, I was always fighting, I couldn't research my way to summons to help, not that I would have had the gems to summon much of anything anyway.

It's possible the dragons might fare better in MP because a low army strength doesn't result in an automatic gang-up like it does against the AI but I still don't like it. This race needs room or it dies.

rdonj · #3 January 2nd, 2009, 09:21 PM

The new map should make that a bit better... with 130 provinces and 7 players, that's 18 provinces a player, versus the current 69/7 = 9.8. The current map is definitely crowded for 7 races, it will be very hard to expand much with so few provinces. Just curious, what difficulty were you playing on?

I think for dom3k the bonebiters are actually probably not an optimal choice, you'd probably have better luck with ghost dragons. Fighting in space is probably also a good idea, since most races are weaker in space. Unfortunately jomon is not one of those races, and R'lyeh is a terrible enemy for the dragons to have to fight period, because of mind blasting.

Loren · #4 January 3rd, 2009, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rdonj

The new map should make that a bit better... with 130 provinces and 7 players, that's 18 provinces a player, versus the current 69/7 = 9.8. The current map is definitely crowded for 7 races, it will be very hard to expand much with so few provinces. Just curious, what difficulty were you playing on?

Normal.

The ghosts can't take out many of the more powerful leaders and the ability to control the enemy with the ghosts is essential for the dragons.

Quote:

I think for dom3k the bonebiters are actually probably not an optimal choice, you'd probably have better luck with ghost dragons. Fighting in space is probably also a good idea, since most races are weaker in space. Unfortunately jomon is not one of those races, and R'lyeh is a terrible enemy for the dragons to have to fight period, because of mind blasting.

I wasn't even using them. They're no longer worth it.

rdonj · #5 January 3rd, 2009, 02:02 PM

Oops, I wasn't thinking at the time, sorry.

rdonj · #6 January 3rd, 2009, 06:29 PM

Umm... I just started a new game with the dragons under the new version and ended up in province 1 with no starting army. I'm not quite sure why, I checked the .dm and the lines for starting units are there. I think maybe it's the province. Btw, you never did fix the venemous dragon's ranged attack.

rdonj · #7 January 3rd, 2009, 08:07 PM

Monster number 1394, a space kraken is named "predator alien". It's possible it's both ways, I didn't see. Also I have some monter number 0 PD in a forest with dragons.

Well, it's possible to expand with the dragons, but it is REALLY hard to accomplish a lot. I had to use ghost dragons to assassinate most things, and steel dragons to take krakens. Haven't met many space eels but I was able to kill one by sending 3 stargazers set to cast personal luck and attack. Though blessing first would be a good idea to get a little extra morale. I think as things are now the dragons are definitely the weakest race, they can make annoying for other people by assassinating commanders, but they're stuck at their weak level for far too long. I don't think that a rainbow pretender with paths within booster range will work, at least for this map, as you basically need to hit construction 6 to summon anything. Couple that with the amount of research and gems you need to summon anything, you're looking at several years of research before you can summon anything.

I think the dragons need to ramp up faster, and possibly reduce the cost of the summons. Possible changes to make them more competetive in dom3k:
1. Give at least some of the dragons a research boost of a couple points.
2: Make stargazers recruit-everywhere.
3: Make another type of dragon that's good at research and not horribly expensive, but otherwise relatively useless.
4: Give the dragons some level of air magic on recruitables, even just 1 air on stargazers would be enough.
4: Reduce the cost of the level 5 conjurations by about 10 or so gems. They might end up being slightly cheap for that level, but you still want 10-35 extra gems worth of equipment to use them, and since you can't get forge bonuses for the nation they'd still be a lot more expensive than something like a bane lord. Plus the dragons need thugs more than other races anyway.