Why convert the starting scout to a prophet in turn 1

[Gandalf Parker]

As with everything there are pros and cons.
For some nations the dominion in Dominions is very important. For some the priests are also so important as to want to squeeze every possible one out without sacrificing your few good war commanders.

The game settings can affect quite abit also. Small-map blitz games means waiting for safe expansion or a better prophet can be a very bad idea when compared to putting a stealth preacher up next to your neighbor very early in the game.

Ive also seen the tactic of using the stealth-preaching immediately to push your dominion a certain direction in order to prepare an area for the arrival of their god (a Super Combat pretender). Not only a good tactic but also a very thematic role play.

[Illuminated One]

Originally Posted by Squirrelloid

You want stealth preaching. A unit with sneak and Hx can preach while hiding, allowing you pinpoint targetting on dominion spread, possibly in a dom-kill attempt. And he gets his prophet dom-spread check as well. Speaking of...

Did you try this?
I did, even backed up by stealthy priests and normal domspread, no way.
A h3 priest has a 90% chance - 5 * enemy domstrength, so against a dom 6 (which is already on the lower end) you have 60% chance to reduce a candle from the capital and another one for being prophet, but the enemy gets 3 to 6 100% chances or so every turn...

He is quite handy to push away evil dom though.

[Jarkko]

Originally Posted by Torin

mainly is for the encumbrance factor.
Your army commander tire fast=few smites till he faints

If the commander has encumbarance 6, how many times could he as prophet smite before passing out?


Personally I practically always prophetise the initial commander (the exception is if I can recruit a H3 priest to prophetise to H4 (I am ready to do illegal stuff to get somebody able to cast Fanaticism )or if I can recruit a SC or heavy-duty thug to prophetise), and definitively not the scout. To me the heroic skills are way more important than the possibility to sneaky-preach (but I can see why some would think otherwise), and the prophet is practically guaranteed to get the heroic skill from first combat. A military commander getting heroic skill makes them benefit from almost all heroic skills (more hitpoints, attack, defense, strength, protection they all are great for a commander-prophet, not to mention awe or reinvigoration etc), while on a scout they most likely would go wasted. Besides, a dead prophet in the HoF can be recalled as a mummy, and that is a pretty nice way to get a H3 reanimator and a thug (he'll have his heroic skill even as a mummy; did I tell about this obese prophet who got mummified and had 120 hitpoints towards the end of the game?).

[vfb]

Originally Posted by Illuminated One

Did you try this?
I did, even backed up by stealthy priests and normal domspread, no way.
A h3 priest has a 90% chance - 5 * enemy domstrength, so against a dom 6 (which is already on the lower end) you have 60% chance to reduce a candle from the capital and another one for being prophet, but the enemy gets 3 to 6 100% chances or so every turn...

He is quite handy to push away evil dom though.

Every bit helps. It's especially useful if you've captured the capitol and are preaching there, but the dominion you are trying to kill exists in a neighbor province that you cannot invade (because it belongs to a third party, or because your army needs to sit on the cap in case of a possibility of break siege). This can make the difference between an easy capitol capture from a dom kill, and a hellacious fight against a horde of enemy mages.

[Torin]

You actually have to check spell casting encumbrance to know, its higher than normal encumbrance.
6 is too low, i dont have the game here but checking edis db`s excel i dont see any starting commander with 6. But i checked 2 early era nations:

EA Ermor - Centurion is sc enc 7 , wich is very acceptable and gets you 14 smites before faints
EA Acrocephale - Myrmidon champion is sc enc 17 - only 5 smites before faints

in edis db its labeled enc2

so sometimes is better to prophetize your commander, sure.

[Illuminated One]

Originally Posted by vfb

Every bit helps. It's especially useful if you've captured the capitol and are preaching there, but the dominion you are trying to kill exists in a neighbor province that you cannot invade (because it belongs to a third party, or because your army needs to sit on the cap in case of a possibility of break siege). This can make the difference between an easy capitol capture from a dom kill, and a hellacious fight against a horde of enemy mages.

Hmm, well I was thinking of domkill as a strategy not as a coup de grace now. In that case it might help you, however I'd still say that's a niche situation - as soon as your enemy realizes his dom is dying he has no other chance than to try and break the siege and give you the fight.

[thejeff]

And it's a niche situation that doesn't require a stealthy prophet.

A stealthy prophet might be useful against a nearby low dominion nation, but you don't know you've got one of those when you appoint your first prophet.
And if you're using him for that you don't get to use him in battle. And run the risk of him being caught by patrollers.

[Squirrelloid]

Originally Posted by thejeff

And it's a niche situation that doesn't require a stealthy prophet.

A stealthy prophet might be useful against a nearby low dominion nation, but you don't know you've got one of those when you appoint your first prophet.
And if you're using him for that you don't get to use him in battle. And run the risk of him being caught by patrollers.

Stealth preaching, unlike a spy's 'create unrest' ability, does not give your opponent any warning. So he wouldn't know to patrol (and PD, even large amounts of PD, are inefficient at catching sneaking units).

Also, its a tool in his toolkit - you can use him in support of your army, but a stealthy prophet *also* provides the capability to stealth preach and domspread, which you might find useful.

And as has been mentioned, you can always kill him off to make someone else prophet later, with little consequence to your military position.

[vfb]

Originally Posted by Illuminated One

Hmm, well I was thinking of domkill as a strategy not as a coup de grace now. In that case it might help you, however I'd still say that's a niche situation - as soon as your enemy realizes his dom is dying he has no other chance than to try and break the siege and give you the fight.

Well, I just had that niche situation happen twice in a row in the same game. YMMV of course, and it helps to have H3s and/or inquisitors to actually wipe out the enemy cap dominion.

[chrispedersen]

Usually I prophetize the scout when I:

a). I need the commander to patrol, because I've set the taxes to 200 or so.

b. When I need the extra fire power - for example some nations have standard commanders - so keeping them near the troops is a good idea.

c. I like flying scouts - so pangaiea is cool.
d. Some units (vanheim?) have mages that are too useful to prophetize.