Mictlan

[Endoperez]

DominionsFAN said:
You know, there should be a way to "upgrade" the national troops. Example regular national swordsman -> veteran national swordsman -> elite national swordsman. Thats 1/2/3 levels. Now, as they reach a new level, they gonna be more powerful and get better equipments. I have no idea, that how could this be implented with the Doms 3. engine. However there is an easier way. Add them as summons maybe. Like Abysia level 2 national troops would be a level 3 fire spell, level 3 national troops would be a level 5 fire spell.
If these things can be modded [I think yes], this is actually a good idea for the modders.

What if they could be recruited just as normal? Say, Pythium could have older and more skilled legionaires. Historically, the Alae Legionaire and Velites were accompanied by more skilled Principes, Hastati and Triarii - which already exist.

I still think all summoned units with high stats should start with one or two stars of experience, and their stats should be lowered accordingly. This would help to make national units actually close the cap instead of getting a very small headstart in the beginning.

[DominionsFan]

Hm I dont know, but national troops should "do good" in endgame somehow. The only way to make it..to add new national troops not just monsters as late game summons. Well imho..

[Oversway]

Would it count if nations had more recruitable sc type troops? Maybe they cost 1000 gold (or more) apiece so you don't start recruiting them until late game when you have tons of gold.

Of course, the other national troops would still become worthless.

[Saber Cherry]

Oversway said:

Would it count if nations had more recruitable sc type troops? Maybe they cost 1000 gold (or more) apiece so you don't start recruiting them until late game when you have tons of gold.

Of course, the other national troops would still become worthless.

Wouldn't help, because summons need no upkeep.

[NTJedi]

Saber Cherry said:

Wouldn't help, because summons need no upkeep.

I agree the upkeep percentage from 1000 gold would be quite high even being sacred.

Most summoned units have multiple advantages over national troops. Some of these include:
Never flee in battle
Never needs food
No gold upkeep
More powerful

Ways national troops can be improved:
1) Allow most nations to have their national troops increase population for whatever province they reside.
2) Allow national troops to be upgraded making their gold/food upkeep more acceptable. one example listed by: DominionsFAN
3) Allow some method for national troops to be upgraded with gems.
4) Allow national troops to provide increased morale, defense and attack for province defense... seems logical their presence within the province would have this effect. Perhaps for this bonus to work the national troops would have to be equal to the province defense, thus 10 PD would need 10 national troops for the bonus.

[Fate]

What about making higher level summons require more than 1 command slot? Is that possible? It would make sense, as those monsters would take more concentration to control...

Another possibility is making some national troops specifically designed for late game (higher Magic Resistance, maybe some special abilities...) , but their stats & higher cost make them useless vs. early game indies.

A final possibility is making buffs that affect only recruited troops, but not summoned ones.

[Sandman]

Just make national troops better. Give them more cool abilities. The best national troops (Vans, Jotuns, Pangaeans) all have multiple great abilities, whilst human troops only have a few stat increments here and there.

For example, why not give all mundane humans doubled experience to represent their flexibility? And yes, they can get ten stars.

[NTJedi]

Sandman said:
Just make national troops better. Give them more cool abilities. The best national troops (Vans, Jotuns, Pangaeans) all have multiple great abilities, whilst human troops only have a few stat increments here and there.

For example, why not give all mundane humans doubled experience to represent their flexibility? And yes, they can get ten stars.

excellent suggestions I will add those to the list:

Most summoned units have multiple advantages over national troops. Some of these include:
Never flee in battle
Never needs food
No gold upkeep
More powerful

Ways national troops can be improved:
1) Allow most nations to have their national troops increase population for whatever province they reside.
2) Allow national troops to be upgraded making their gold/food upkeep more acceptable. one example listed by: DominionsFAN
3) Allow some method for national troops to be upgraded with gems.
4) Allow national troops to provide increased morale, defense and attack for province defense... seems logical their presence within the province would have this effect. Perhaps for this bonus to work the national troops would have to be equal to the province defense, thus 10 PD would need 10 national troops for the bonus.
5) Providing national troops with increased statistics by receiving faster experience upgrades and the ability to receive higher experience thus 10 stars instead of 5 stars. as suggested by Sandman

[DominionsFan]

Guys, that wont work. Basic national troops cant be much better, that would imbalance the early-mid game summons. Minor basic national troop upgrades wont help, so its not necessary at all. Like I said, imho the only way to "play" with national troops in mid/late game is to add mid [call it level 2] / high [call it level 3] national troop summons. That way the basic "vanilla" [level 1] national troops would be obsolete in mid game, and the mid game national troops coming from summons [level 2] would be obsolete in the end game, when the player would be able to summon level 3 national troops. I think this is the best way, in fact Im gonna try to do this in my mod. I am pretty sure that this is doable somehow with modding.

[Sandman]

It depends on the nature of the improvement. Some abilities don't matter in the early game, but become good later on.

For example, if you were to give magical weapons to all Ulmish troops, it wouldn't really affect the early game, but it would make Ulm perform far better in the late game, with a lot of ethereal creatures in play.