Dug-in Infantry, Artillery Bombardment, Kills and Casaulty Reports

[jivemi]

Thanks everyone for your prompt, informative and helpful responses. It was especially gratifying to receive confirmation concerning limited casualty reports with fast arty ON. That helps to explain why some dug-in infantry were eliminated after only a couple of direct-fire casualties. (BTW this was an AI-generated campaign battle so there were no "customized" preferences or unit capabilities--I always play with stock values at 100%.)

Nobody took a stab at question #3 though. No doubt it's an arcane issue which is both complicated in theory and risky in practice. The bottom line is, heavies definitely cause casualties and given enough saturation can drive infantry from their holes. A most useful thing to know. Thanks again everybody!

[scorpio_rocks]

3/. My guess would be: yes - troops are unlikely to be affected by things (enemy troops) they are unaware of.

[Imp]

3/ Never taken it into account, certainly adjacent armour can effect morale.
Only things I tend to remember with morale is being in a fortification or causing damage increases it while watching your buddies die or take damage is not good for it.

[Aeraaa]

I wasn't able to confirm this, but I have the perception that units that overcrowd a hex are more susceptible to artillery effects. With infantry this is a no brainer, but even with armor I witness far more damaged or KOed tanks when there are say 3 of them in a single hex.

Regarding dug-in units, calibers 122mm or greater are the ones more likely to produce casualties (although I do get some odd successes once in a while, f.e. a 25-pounder knocking out a dug-in Panther tank, or an 81mm mortar killing an infantryman). The others are good for morale purposes. Regardless of that, ALWAYS use artillery when assaulting dug-in units, it will make your life much easier (just careful when close to enemy positions and fire is unobserved, friendly fire sucks).

[shahadi]

Originally Posted by Aeraaa

I wasn't able to confirm this, but I have the perception that units that overcrowd a hex are more susceptible to artillery effects. With infantry this is a no brainer, but even with armor I witness far more damaged or KOed tanks when there are say 3 of them in a single hex.

Regarding dug-in units, calibers 122mm or greater are the ones more likely to produce casualties (although I do get some odd successes once in a while, f.e. a 25-pounder knocking out a dug-in Panther tank, or an 81mm mortar killing an infantryman). The others are good for morale purposes. Regardless of that, ALWAYS use artillery when assaulting dug-in units, it will make your life much easier (just careful when close to enemy positions and fire is unobserved, friendly fire sucks).

"...careful when close to enemy positions and fire is unobserved.."

Oh yes you will get burned if you by close 200m. I'd rather position my units further back say 450m with assault teams (MGs and snipers), units that can add suppression at range above an infantry rifle. If available, I'd put a couple of IFV to give me added suppression and ability to close with any routed units quickly from 500m back.

But what is most telling in the above quote that I selected is that you must have dedicated field artillery observer to make the call. I know they are expensive but get one over there at that point to call in your arty fires so as to mitigate loss due to friendly fire, especially if you have units as close as 200m, danger close.

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[Mobhack]

Originally Posted by scorpio_rocks

3/. My guess would be: yes - troops are unlikely to be affected by things (enemy troops) they are unaware of.

Enemy need to know there are opponents nearby before reacting to them. Unspotted troops wont trigger any "enemy near" adverse morale results.

Units in cover (trenches, rough etc) when badly suppressed will "hunker down" rather than run away, unless they know enemy is nearby and they fail a morale test. Even units in retreat or rout morale state will often remain in the cover hunkered down, but unable to fight effectively - these are "neutralised troops". Units at maximum suppression but not in retreat may also be considered as neutralised - they may not even spot you nearby, or if they do they are likely to have "firer panicked" results should they attempt to fire at 1 hex when severely suppressed.

If I am splattering an area with loads of arty, I often keep fast little units close to the barrage - armoured cars say, or motorcyclists (though those can suffer too many pinned results from hugging the barrage at times). I use these to nip into the beaten and smoke-ridden impact zone and find any neutralised (pinned in place, but either in retreat status, or too much suppressed to spot you) and then shoot up these stunned grunts. I then zip back out of the beaten zone. The main point is to get grunts out of cover so they dont hunker down, so I dont try to kill them with extra fires unless they were down near dispersal levels. The artillery about to land will be the main killer once they are flushed into the open, and once out in the open any with retreat or rout level will tend to keep on running - if in cover, they may not.

If you just stand outside a bombarded area waiting for the enemy to "magically go away" - they likely wont, in any useful amount of time. Especially dug in troops that have trenches to shelter from the bombardment - they know its better to hunker down and endure the shelling rather than do a runner!.

You do need to go in and use the bayonet on them really, or depleted units in cover will still be hunkered down weathering the barrage.

You can rally away any suppression caused by "leaning" on the barrage often enough. he has to stay suppressed till his turn.

So -
- make sure he knows you are close by. He may fail morale tests and run away from you. Eventually.
- and/or go in and engage him when you think he has been suppressed to neutralisation levels. In other words, take full advantage of the barrage effects.

[jp10]

Since Naval gunfire was mentioned...
When delivering INDIRECT naval artillery (gun) fire support from a moving ship, the firing data is plotted from a position ahead of the ship and the guns fire as the ship reaches that point. The large bursting area of a 16" shell is offset by the slower rate of fire. In US Battleship operations, each turret would often operate as an independent battery. This would allow three separate targets to be engaged by an Iowa class BB with 3 shells each.
The game may seem to under rate the shell's power but IMO it also gives them a higher ROF and quicker response time. This does not cover DIRECT fire and I note the game generalizes the variety of ship classes.