An idea concerning National Heroes - Page 2

Argitoth · #11 November 28th, 2003, 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Saber Cherry:
I'd like to import heroes into Doms II from Progress Quest ( www.progressquest.com )

what is that website?

Arralen · #12 November 28th, 2003, 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by cpbeller:
What about being able to send your National Heroes on quests? I don't know exactly how it could be done, possibly something along the lines of their stats and all, mixed with some die rolls.

Oh no.

Reminds me of the fabulous, most guarded secret and well-rounded awe-inspiring winning condition from Moo3:

The great X.
Discover them, research them, steal them .. and experience a totally new and exciting way to win a 3-eX-strategy game. .. so far the blurb.

Reality:
Klick on some of your ships at some random point in the game.
Select order "search for X".
Have the ships transfer out of the fleets into some static list.
Wait for a message some dozend turns later: "ship destroyed", "ship lost" or "X" found.
.. nothing you could really do about it ..

It's no fun, it's boring.

No need to put this in DOM2 too.

Ok, I must admit the whole thing obviously got nerfed in Moo3: There are Black Holes and Neutron Stars on the map, and you can set them as waypoints for ships, but it's nothing there. At some point in the beta there where events connected to such exploration missions.

So if quests are added to DOM2, it shouldn't be something like "hero vanishes and reemerges some random turns later", it should be something like real mission or the like.
Maybe a random event: hero gets a hint about a hidden magic site, has to travel there (stealthed or by fighting his way through), has to bring something along & enter the site for something to happen ...

.. just my 0,02 EUR

A.

EDITED: spelling ...

[ November 28, 2003, 09:49: Message edited by: Arralen ]

MythicalMino · #13 November 28th, 2003, 01:50 PM

i was simply asking for something along the lines of the death match message, and you choose (if you have one) a National Hero to go. It would only take 1-6 turns (most likely, I would like the one turn deal)....if the Hero is successful, then a major & unique artifact is found by the hero....but it should link to link especially....And this wouldn't be a "game-winning" either....just something a bit more...

Teraswaerto · #14 November 28th, 2003, 03:23 PM

Maybe the hero would have to fight a random monster or monsters, similar to the Arena Deathmatch, and the reward would depend on what the monster was, ie. you would get a better reward if it was a wraith lord than if it was a bunch of ghouls.

Arralen · #15 November 28th, 2003, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by cpbeller:
i was simply asking for something along the lines of the death match message, and you choose (if you have one) a National Hero to go. It would only take 1-6 turns (most likely, I would like the one turn deal)....if the Hero is successful, then a major & unique artifact is found by the hero[/QB]

So it's simply a random artifact, and you "pay" for it with not using the hero for a turn or so.

I tried to put the emphasis not on the fact that the "X" is a winning condition, but that it would need more effort to make the thing worth it.

Getting something randomly for a small amount of additional micromangagement does not add much to the game IMHO.

A.

Gandalf Parker · #16 November 28th, 2003, 04:08 PM

Both viewpoints are true. I think the original idea was for full quests along the line of Age of Wonders. But I kindof nerfed it by suggestiong that a simpler Version might be put in sooner using the "death match" code.

MythicalMino · #17 November 28th, 2003, 04:46 PM

well, i would like to see the Heroes be featured a bit more though. It could be a death match type deal, where the hero has to fight off different types of monsters...the higher level monster, gives a better artifact or magical item. Or, it could just be a "flavor" type of thing....just something to add a little extra "story" to the game. Either way, it is just something I personally would like to see.

I understand that the devs may see this as just something that doesn't add anything to the game....but, they also have said that they wanted the arena fights in just for the "fun" factor....

Heroes need quests....to gain fame and glory. This could also be something to propel them into the Hero Hall of Fame too....There could be more that would make the player want to use the feature than just more micromanagment....

I only seen something in another game though, and thought it would be cool if it could be implemented into Dominions also....

Raen · #18 November 28th, 2003, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Arralen:
Getting something randomly for a small amount of additional micromangagement does not add much to the game IMHO.

A.

Well, you also "pay" for it by the hero having a good chance of dying on the quest (I assume that was part of the original idea?), just as with the Arena matches.

IOW, gamble that you might get an artifact instead of losing the hero for no gain. Sounds like a perfectly reasonable idea to me.

MythicalMino · #19 November 28th, 2003, 08:06 PM

well, of course....higher the risk, the greater the gain...right?

Like I said though, I would just like to see Heroes take a more interesting part in the Ascension Wars....and Heroes go on quests.

I mean, if Illwinter REALLY wanted to get into it...they could have each nation have only "nation-specific" quests....Like, Marignon sends out a hero to recover the "Last Cup of the First Supper" (or something like that)...the Cup is held captive by 3 Ashen Angels. The Hero needs to travel (could be anywhere from 1 month to 6 months) to the place (not known to the known world)....If the hero dies in combat vs. the Angels, or he could even die on the way there, then the quest fails. If he wind the fight, and returns with the "Last Cup of the First Supper", then that would be a unique artifact, giving the Marignon advantages or soemthing. Also, stories of the Hero's brave quest would travel through the land, making him have more fame on the Hall of Fame board....

The devs would know if this would be worth-while to pursue...or if it can be added at all. If they say "no way", ok....I won't be upset or anything....

Taqwus · #20 November 29th, 2003, 03:21 AM

KODP did Hero Quests pretty well (and certain of them were extremely dangerous even for experienced Ring members who worshipped the appropriate deity, and even with full knowledge of how the HQ's supposed to work; the Uralda quest comes to mind). However, that was a completely different type of game featuring much more plot and backstory. In addition, having that level of detail makes it difficult to include many.

I'm not sure why a quest should be limited to national heroes (well, not explicitly; it should be difficult, and the difficulty may as a practical matter require heroic prowess or fortitude or what-not); one of the ways to become a hero, in fact, should be to do something amazing for the nation.

I could see National Heroes getting better abilities by default. For instance, it wouldn't seem remiss to me for all to receive some level of Standard ability by default. Some could use abilities that don't necessarily exist yet in game but would make sense in light of their description; Marius Lorca and his guards, if any, having a chance to intervene against assassination battles, for instance, or the Rage Lord generally having a retinue of Lava Warriors.