Attack of the Ankle-Biters - Replacment player needed.

[Slynky]

Well, here I come with my big mouth .

Just random thoughts.

I'm somewhat/curiously interested in Slick's suggestion for a game. I'd rather see it go up to a destroyer (mentioned below, I think) than hang at frigates. I'm just guessing but having frigates be your "dreadnaughts" might make a planet impregnable. Certainly, one with moderate cargo space for WPs. Throw in 100 mines and some space defenses and it becomes a real problem. Also, did I just miss it or have satellites been mentioned? Would fighters be allowed (you just can't build a carrier)?

The other discussion, which would seem to indicate a mod, is interesting, too. I rarely play mod games, though (hell, it took me years just to become a half-assed player with the standard game...I'd hate to think of my learning curve in a mod... ). Besides, Slick's game could start right away .

The mention of miniturization of components would seem to defeat the purpose of a game with small hulls. After all, if one can build a 5 or 600Kt ship with all the components (due to miniturization) that a dreadnaught can currently hold, doesn't the game really stay about the same?

Slick, what kind of racial points were you comptemplating?

[Slick]

So slick, are you gonna do this?

Not sure what exactly you are asking. My original post mentioned that I didn't have time for another game right now so I won't be setting up a game. I just posted my idea in case anyone thought it might be interesting and/or wanted to expand on it.

Slick, what kind of racial points were you comptemplating?

What I had in mind would be a game where all players were limited to small ship sizes. I think if it were a racial trait and other races had big ships, the small ship empire would be unwinnable.

If I were going to do this (I don't plan to in the near future), I think the easiest way would be to edit only vehicles.txt. Then play a test game to find if there are fatal flaws, tweak if necessary, then start a real game.

Sheez. I feel bad now. I just wanted to post an interesting idea I had. I sure wish I had more time to run with it. Either on the mod side or on the play side. Work and real life will be keeping me very busy well through the end of the year and possibly into next.

Pax, best of luck with any of your efforts. You may be right about planets being too hard to attack with Frigates. I guess playtesting will tell. I also agree that miniaturization (sp?) mounts will counteract the idea.

Slick.

[geoschmo]

Originally posted by Slick:
Not sure what exactly you are asking. My original post mentioned that I didn't have time for another game right now so I won't be setting up a game. I just posted my idea in case anyone thought it might be interesting and/or wanted to expand on it.

Yeah, I read that. I was thinking maybe that the discussion had increased your own interest to the point where you were going to go ahead and do it.

[Slynky]

Not sure why vehicles.txt would have to be edited. If you mean removing ship classes, I think honor could take care of that. Otherwise, perhaps I missed a suggested change or two somewhere... .

I once played a game with Lord Chane where we did something a LITTLE bit different. We limited fleet sizes to 10 ships. Gentleman's agreement. So, even with ships of any size, it was hard to take large and huge breathables. I guess because people knew there could only be 10 ships in a fleet, so it became more worthwhile to build WPs as it became more possible to defend planets. So, in a way, "ankle-biting" will be a bit similar, I think. Of course, with 10 ships to a fleet, there was a finite limit of total tons one could throw against a planet. It wouldn't be the same with 100 frigates... .

[Slynky]

Originally posted by geoschmo:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Slick:
Not sure what exactly you are asking. My original post mentioned that I didn't have time for another game right now so I won't be setting up a game. I just posted my idea in case anyone thought it might be interesting and/or wanted to expand on it.

Yeah, I read that. I was thinking maybe that the discussion had increased your own interest to the point where you were going to go ahead and do it.

---

Yeah, Geo, he might be thinking, "DRAT! It's gaining interest and I DON'T have time!"

Problem is, IF one thinks they don't have time, it's usually the case. After all, there are lots of players who THINK they have time for another game and DON'T... .

[geoschmo]

Originally posted by Slynky:
After all, there are lots of players who THINK they have time for another game and DON'T... .

Well I just don't know who you are talking about.

I did some quick tests and frigates might be fine. Yeah taking out big planets would be a lot tougher, but I don't think it would be impossible. Even with the big weapons plats with high tech weapons you can overcome it with enough ships. What it would do is make you build ships with the anti-planetary weapons and keep you fleets in formation. For example it might take 200-300 frigates with APB and no formation to take out a homeworld, but 50-75 frigates with napalm in a wall formation might be able to pull it off. And a mass of drones might do the job even easier. I havn't tested that.

On the other hand since you are limiting ships you could also limit weapons platform sizes. and maybe Drones as well.

One thing that could be a problem though is some fo the stellar manip comps won't fit on a frigate, or even a destroyer.

Geoschmo

[ July 27, 2003, 18:41: Message edited by: geoschmo ]

[Slynky]

Originally posted by geoschmo:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Slynky:
After all, there are lots of players who THINK they have time for another game and DON'T... .

Well I just don't know who you are talking about.

I did some quick tests and frigates might be fine. Yeah taking out big planets would be a lot tougher, but I don't think it would be impossible. Even with the big weapons plats with high tech weapons you can overcome it with enough ships. What it would do is make you build ships with the anti-planetary weapons and keep you fleets in formation. For example it might take 200-300 frigates with APB and no formation to take out a homeworld, but 50-75 frigates with napalm in a wall formation might be able to pull it off. And a mass of drones might do the job even easier. I havn't tested that.

On the other hand since you are limiting ships you could also limit weapons platform sizes. and maybe Drones as well.

One thing that could be a problem though is some fo the stellar manip comps won't fit on a frigate, or even a destroyer.

Geoschmo

---

Nope, NOT talking about anyone in particular, Geo. Just remembering the number of games where it seems someone dropped out due to lack of time.

Wall formation? Hehe, since I see my "walls" turned every-which-way, it'd be my luck they'd go in "single file" formation to the planet... .

NO Stellar Manip? Well, you can't put an opener and a repair component on a frigate (and without the repair, it's not worth the build). Those 2 items are 250Kt alone. Now, you can work a bit with a destroyer (if you have master comp 3, quantum engine...note, I said "engine", and sail 3).

[Krsqk]

You'd just start having 2-ship "mini-fleets" for stellar manip. One with the opener/closer, one with the repair. Not as pretty or convenient, but still functional. Of course, I get the idea that's the whole point of this mod.

[Slick]

Actually, with 15kT to work with, at best you have a satt/minelayer. I would NEVER make a 150kT carrier (one launch bay, MAYBE two ... ? nosir ... gotta be at least 5, thanks!)

That's where the inventive designs come in. If you want 5 launch bays on a Frigate, it can be done. One option would be:

1 MC
1 Engine
5 Fighter Launch Bays
1 Solar Sail

Slow but viable. If the engine was a QE and a Solar Sail III, the speed would be 7 which isn't too bad. I would envision trading engines for space in lots of designs. This goes back to the idea of having to pay much more attention to managing supplies.

Slick.

[Slick]

Oh oh... It's beginning to happen... Must resist... I may (repeat may ) rethink about working on something along these lines. Excuse me while I go soak my head to get this foolish idea out of my head.



Slick.