TI what is it good for?

[Wdll]

Is soviet russia, steel panthers plays you.

[harlikwin]

Originally Posted by Suhiir

On a related subject.

Anyone here had and direct experience with Ground Surveillance Radar (GSR) ?
From my understanding in any terrain with more then minimal vegetation (i.e. anything more then the occasional tree here and there) the stuff is of limited value.

Not exactly true. the flatter and clearer the terrain is the better. But realistically moving things show up in some modes, and metal things tend to reflect radar signals better than trees. I think the treatment of TI in the game is rather simple, especially since since the 90's the vehicle screening smoke or arty smoke has been multispectral (i.e. blocks TI) to use.

Also the TI range is about right, in theory sure you could see forever, but in reality you have a limited sized detector and resolution at long ranges is a real problem. consider the detectors were something like 320x160elements or pixels if you perfer (depended on the model of course).

I would second any motions for allowing units to have TI but with less range (like infantry TI units), also for adding multispectral smoke rounds/SD (does VRISS already do this).

[PlasmaKrab]

You want challenge with TI?
Try the good ole US vs USSR in Germany around '83-84: the best you have in US tanks is 105mm '83, that has a hard time penetrating the current top-notch Soviet T-64B/T-72B/T-80B beyond 1000m, while the 125mm 2A46 model 1983 can toast an IPM1 at about 1500-1800m (according to my tests). That's only tank on tank, so hold the TOWs and plenty of arty on the Eastern side.
And when you're done holding off the red hordes, try assaulting them.

Looks like this is still valid with the v4.5 OOBs.

P.S. ditto on IR-screening smoke, again, feasibility issue...

[PanzerBob]

I've seen the view afforded by TI, and it is awesome.

GSR at least the new stuff with a fair operator is quite good as well. But it is range and site dependant. To be sure I have heard that the earlier versions sucked. And another thing the operator told me was he had a hell of a time convincing some officers the thing just cannot see though solid objects, hills and building etc!! LOL He also worked with the older models and some of our allies older stuff and he said "it used to make his eyes bleed trying to make use of the info in the screen" he certainly didn't have kind words but loved his new equipment.

Bob out

[Ramm]

Originally Posted by PanzerBob

I've seen the view afforded by TI, and it is awesome.

GSR at least the new stuff with a fair operator is quite good as well. But it is range and site dependant. To be sure I have heard that the earlier versions sucked. And another thing the operator told me was he had a hell of a time convincing some officers the thing just cannot see though solid objects, hills and building etc!! LOL He also worked with the older models and some of our allies older stuff and he said "it used to make his eyes bleed trying to make use of the info in the screen" he certainly didn't have kind words but loved his new equipment.


Bob out

makes eyes bleed reminds me of my primary schools' Apple IIe green and black computer monitors

Regards,
Andrew

[Suhiir]

Originally Posted by harlikwin

Not exactly true. the flatter and clearer the terrain is the better. But realistically moving things show up in some modes, and metal things tend to reflect radar signals better than trees. I think the treatment of TI in the game is rather simple, especially since since the 90's the vehicle screening smoke or arty smoke has been multispectral (i.e. blocks TI) to use.

Also the TI range is about right, in theory sure you could see forever, but in reality you have a limited sized detector and resolution at long ranges is a real problem. consider the detectors were something like 320x160elements or pixels if you perfer (depended on the model of course).

I would second any motions for allowing units to have TI but with less range (like infantry TI units), also for adding multispectral smoke rounds/SD (does VRISS already do this).

Shows you what I know about radar
I wasn't aware objects made of different materials reflected it differently - I assumed an object is an object is an object.

That was more my point on the TI range (not that it matters much), the detector size has a rather significant effect on the "effective vision range" of the TI.

And yes, the VRISS in game does act as multispectral smoke, the only "problem" is it only effects a currently incomming round rather then createing a smoke screen.

[Marek_Tucan]

Originally Posted by Suhiir

Shows you what I know about radar

If i may, recommend this book:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glide_Path
by A.C. Clarke, based on his wartime experiences with participation on Ground-Controlled Approach project. There are various interesting radar snippets incl. using the radar for GCA as a sort of GSR to repel an "intruder" training, using the radar to track helmets