Forthcoming patch notes - Page 5

Tifone · #41 July 21st, 2008, 08:04 AM

I still don't understand why should it be raised but if the devs think it's necessary I will of course adapt even if not understanding

Long life to pacific solutions - Peace at you Zeldor

(I think KO reads our threads and makes his consideration by himself?

but good luck with it, what else can I say)

Sombre · #42 July 21st, 2008, 08:21 AM

I think the arguments as to why it should be raised are fairly clear. I don't mind it that much but there are definitely pros and cons.

Twan · #43 July 21st, 2008, 08:32 AM

Quote:

Tifone said:If you tell me that some spells and some situations bring this "turn limit rule" to a bug/exploit level, I can agree that it is unfair. But I think maybe those spells need an adjustement, like it is gonna happen for the MoD phantasms, not the whole turn limit system.

Try playing the Jotun with a E9N10 bless and use werewolves in shroud of battle saint + ring of regeneration (40% regen), with reinvig boots and MR amulet and buffed with luck and body ethearal of course.

These berserk unkillable werewolves make any battle against a big conventional army last 50+ rounds, in most situations they win in defense about as surely as a MoD spell (hum yes there are some % of chance to counter them with slaying spells or some lucky critical hits, K will probably post an example). But due to their berserking their superpower turn against them in attack were they are often autokilled in attack in round 75, if opponents are numerous enough.

A turn limit around round 100 would make more of these battles end by a real victory or defeat instead. A "conventionnal end" being the matter of some lucky critical hits or unlucky moral check finally rolled by the troops surrounding the werewolves, any turn added would reduce the chance of auto-victory/defeat.

Tifone · #44 July 21st, 2008, 08:37 AM

I don't want to sound an unrequested "adviser" or "i-am-the-smart-guy". But a (humble and just one of the possible ones) solution came maybe to my mind, so I'd like to expose it at the attention of you experts for any comment - stone me alive if you wish

.

Wouldn't it be nice if, regardless of the turn, when the whole enemy army has been routed (the "The armies of XXX has routed"), it has, let's say 5 or 10 more turns to retreat all the units, and then the ones remaining on the battlefield of the defeated side - the slow, fatigued ones, the mindless, the phantasm, the unretreating ones, the immobiles - disappear? They didn't make it, they were unable to rout or "out of autonomy", so the winning army and even the paesants of the nation killed/dismantled them?
Wouldn't it be logical and resolving all the problems you have with turn limit?

I feel in real discomfort suggesting things that might take too much time to the devs to implement, or changing the gameplay (that I really like).
But if you guys think at this issue as a problem, maybe this needs to be repaired someway, and imho this one could be a nice, logical solution which doesn't create endless battles (sorry, an hyperbole to talk about the 200! turns long battles someone talked about)

Peace, with humility your friend Tifone

Zeldor · #45 July 21st, 2008, 08:41 AM

Tifone:

The problems is that maybe it would be better, but we should make reasonable requests for devs. Increasing turn limit is easy. Changing mechanics take a lot of time and we can get many other things coded instead.

Tifone · #46 July 21st, 2008, 08:43 AM

Twan - I take your point. You sent your SC to slaugthering the enemies in a province, he is in the good position but the time ends. The month is finished and he didn't kill everybody. If this game was having a system in which a province can has an ingoing battle on, this should be this way. But this is not the case at all. So, should your werewolf be closed with the enemy army in an endless limbo where he can kill everybody in all the time he wants, and the enemy being unable to receive reinforcements for all 100 turns (which is the double of the current battle-time)? mmh. It doesn't seem the solution to me. neither mine is very valid in this situation, I admit, but neither the limbo one. So? We don't have a solution. Maybe someone else has one in mind?

Tifone · #47 July 21st, 2008, 08:47 AM

Zeldor,

Quote:

Tifone said:
I feel in real discomfort suggesting things that might take too much time to the devs to implement, or changing the gameplay (that I really like).

quoting myself, what a pity ^_^
I'm one for asking reasonable things ONLY to the devs. But asking them to change the somehow realistic gameplay of all the battles, because now has its flaws in some situations you pointed out, in a imho LESS logic and realistic way, just seems weird.
I see I'm the minority, I am not playing the devil's advocate. I just defend the way the game works and suggesting that maybe a more logical solution is possible.

Zeldor · #48 July 21st, 2008, 08:53 AM

Tifone:

Really, 1 turn battle may be 15-60 minutes of real battle. Reinforccements argument doesn't work. And it's not about not killing some regenerating/berserk units, but not killing them fast enough before turn limit.

vfb · #49 July 21st, 2008, 08:58 AM

Quote:

Tifone said:
... You sent your SC to slaugthering the enemies in a province, he is in the good position but the time ends. The month is finished and he didn't kill everybody. If this game was having a system in which a province can has an ingoing battle on, this should be this way. But this is not the case at all. So, should your werewolf be closed with the enemy army in an endless limbo where he can kill everybody in all the time he wants, and the enemy being unable to receive reinforcements for all 100 turns (which is the double of the current battle-time)? mmh. It doesn't seem the solution to me. neither mine is very valid in this situation, I admit, but neither the limbo one. So? We don't have a solution. Maybe someone else has one in mind?

One suggestion was for attacking armies to retreat to a random neighboring friendly province when the "battle timer" runs out, instead of just evaporating in a puff of bodily vapours. That's only for awake, mobile units in the attacking army, of course, and only helps if you have a province to retreat to. And it doesn't do much to help VoD.

Tifone · #50 July 21st, 2008, 09:01 AM

Oh, I didn't know you were a "real battles" electric stopwatcher Zeldor

Your argument is the one which doesn't work. Those are SAMPLES of battles. Real battles for what that matters aren't in turns, aren't often in full open field, aren't without difference in terrain, aren't without units taking cover... but surely real warfare IS involving the use of reinforcements coming from the back lines and the barracks of your nation, even by aircraft (and we /have/ fast air units here) to replace the dead and the wounded. If this must be eliminated by a strategic game, it loses some of the pure strategic part, you can't deny it, really.

Peace