Adjudication on a NAP -edited please comment again

[zenphos]

Hmmmm,
I seem to be saying that a lot.
If I had received a maybe to my NAP response I would have assumed he was stalling for time while bringing up a massive army to invade me and as such I would have either attacked him before he was ready, or if not in a position to do so would have hurriedly fortified my borders and would have started moving armies back in an attempt to repel his invasion.
I have NAP's and trade agreements with other players in other games and with all of them have been very cautious until the other side has sent a response saying yes the terms you suggested are agreeable to me and I consider the agreement signed.
In fact this exact same situation happened to me in another game, but in reverse, where I requested a NAP2 and got a response asking for a NAP4 instead. The next turn I sent back a response saying that I agreed to a NAP4 and it was only then that our armies moved away from each others respective borders, but I still kept a scout down there just in case.
This is dominions after all and at some point you will either be invaded or someone will invade you, from what I have seen normally with the aid of another player. So I figure it is always best to be on the alert. And if you receive ambiguous or no answers to your messages I would always assume it to mean there is something not right and best to prepare yourself.

[Saxon]

The nature of the internet leads to a couple of problems, which we all need to be cognizant of while writing. First, we are almost all role playing, all the time, to a certain extent. Why do I post as Saxon instead of Dave? Why make up a false name and then post under it? I am role playing. I might be unaware of the fact, but that does not change it. If I compound that by taking on another role in a game, I am moving another step away from my true self and another step into fiction.

Throw in a dispute and mix in two layers of unclear identity and the situation is more prone to problems. The deeper you go into fiction, the farther you are from facts. If you really want to solve a dispute, stop role playing. If you are not that worried about the dispute, keep role playing and accept the cost.

Another thing about the internet is that there is no body language or tone of voice. In real life, you use those things when you want to say something you suspect will not be received well or thought of as uncouth. When posting, you have to do something else, like put a smiley or say things like “no offense.” These methods are the social grease that keep us from fighting, in real life or on the more civilized forums. They don’t happen so much in the school playground or less civilized forums, so they dissolve into wresting matches and flame wars. It is a choice. Goofy sounding posts or flame wars.

Zenphos, I won’t start with “no offense” this time, since you would like it straight.

You have asked for an adjudication, but said you do not want to be judged. The root of the word adjudication is judgment, so you can not have one without the other. When you put yourself out on the boards asking for opinions, expect to get them and expect you won’t like them all. Also, don’t complain that I have judged you without all the facts. You have presented the facts and provided a fair opportunity for your opponent to present the facts. I just worked with what you two gave me.

I agree with you, technically, there was no NAP. However, that you feel the need to clear your good name is because your actions were less than ideal. I am not surprised your opponent is complaining about your behavior and won’t be surprised if other players do not trust you or want to play with you in the future. I also suspect he is going to get more support and sympathy than either you or me.

As for my sanctimoniousness, you are right again. I often am. However, I wager that while some players will see me as a pain in the butt, they will trust my NAP and negotiations.

[zenphos]

Hah,

Well actually I did realise adjudication meant judgment, but I wanted a situation judged, not me or my actions.
I did not feel the need to clear my name but instead thought it would be an interesting exercise to see what people thought and whether there was an agreement in place and if the forum had agreed there was then I would have withdrawn my armies.
Although now I am thinking I would have been better off not bothering, wiped him out and moved on.
As for my opponent, he was at the time the leaderboard nation.
He had most of the mercenaries, the most forts, the most provinces and the biggest armies. All of which he either is still at the top of or very close to the top.
He mercilessly crushed some guy early in the game with a cheesy mercenary rush which I found to be pretty harsh in a newbie game. I mean if an experienced player falls for it then that is their fault but to merc rush a newbie is in pretty poor spirit I thought and sign of a guy without a lot of mercy when it comes to his dealings with other players.
He also had an army of 250 men a turn away from my border when I attacked so he is not in a hopeless situation with all his armies 4 or 5 turns away. And I am pretty confident he has another 200 men 2 turns away.
3 forts he can recruit from plenty of money coming in and I am guessing by now he has shored up some allies on his other borders so he can focus everything he has on me.

So I guess this is what I meant when I said not in possession of all the facts. Basically I thought some merciless, cold blooded newbie rusher was in the process of preparing an invasion of my lands with 250 men and some elephants. Turns out he wasn't but I didn't know that at the time.

[Sombre]

Well since we're now judging the players involved as well as the situation, let me say this:

The more Zenphos posts and the more we hear from the other guy, the more I'm glad I said it was a NAP.

Though /technically/ it wasn't (that's the consensus here), I have to side with the other guy.

[Aezeal]

it's all about technicalities... that is how things are in politics, roleplayed or not. It's not a NAP, in the future people dealing with zenphos should just be very carefull about what has been said.. and what hasn't. IMHO that should always be the case though and I really don't blame Zenphos more than the other guy, there was an option without breaking any oaths or whatnot to attack the guy, it was in his favor so he did that.. happens a lot in this game.

[Wrana]

OT - also agree with idea of making # of globals in play an option. Especially as there are slightly more possible globals now as well...

[crumply]

Adjudication:

From a legal perspective (why not), and without thinking about it to deeply (which would be kinda dumb), there was no agreement.

An agreement consists of mutual consent, evidenced by an offer and acceptance. Your situation displays and offer (3 NAP), a counter-offer (2 NAP), which is also a rejection of the initial offer, followed by silence. Silence never constitutes acceptance (if it did, think about the effect of failing to decline all those junk mail offers). Thus, no agreement.

Frankly, I think your opponent is being sort of an obnoxious boob.