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March 23rd, 2017, 02:18 PM
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Shrapnel Fanatic
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: GWN
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Re: MBT's
just curious which ones you are referring to .........the Syrians or the Israelis
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March 23rd, 2017, 09:32 PM
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Major
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Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Yorkshire, UK
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Re: MBT's
Oh sorry the Israeli sinai grey stuff.
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March 24th, 2017, 10:28 AM
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Shrapnel Fanatic
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Join Date: Mar 2005
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Re: MBT's
Yes, the experiment worked well. I could not get much closer to that colour using an actual paint sample wash in 24 bit and there are natural variations in that paint colour anyway
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March 24th, 2017, 10:50 AM
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Major
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Join Date: Aug 2013
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Re: MBT's
I know that what constitutes and / or approximates the colour is an often hotly debated topic on modelling forums. So to pull it off with the limited palette you have to work with is doubly nice!
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March 24th, 2017, 02:18 PM
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Shrapnel Fanatic
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Join Date: Mar 2005
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Re: MBT's
That colour the Israelis use looks different with age and the conditions it's photographed under but that's nothing compared to the variations in Russian paint colour in WW2. I added a camo M4A2 (76) to the Russian winSPWW2 OOB based on a photo and during research into the colours used I found this
Quote:
Camouflage Colors
In the fall of 1939, the RKKA adopted a system of camouflage colors to be applied over the Protective Green 4BO base coat. Up to two additional colors could be used:
Dark Brown 6K, sometimes denoted as 6RP, was a dark earth brown similar to FS30117.
Yellow Earth 7K was a light sand color close to FS23578.
Both paints were supplied in form of thick paste that was diluted with gasoline, kerosene or a special drying oil. Differences in the dilution medium and/or the mixing proportions caused significant variations in the final colors.
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FULL ARTICLE HERE http://www.4bogreen.com/colors
Also, I am finding there are a LOT wider range of colours and tones that can be produced with the game palette than most people think possible |
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March 31st, 2017, 01:28 AM
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Lieutenant General
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Kingsland, GA.
Posts: 2,774
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Re: MBT's
I have many sources of info but, I didn't want anyone to think I pulled the T-90MS story (Post above.) about Kuwait's interest in the tank "outta of my butt" so just released earlier yesterday (Wed.) from one of my main stream sources...
http://www.armyrecognition.com/march..._12203172.html
http://www.armyrecognition.com/russi..._pictures.html
http://www.military-today.com/tanks/t90ms_tagil.htm
We entered this tank to the Russian OOB a few years back, as the T-90AM Russian version of the MS. Last two refs. added if any " tweaking" is required before this tank actually sees the " light of day" most likely for India first as they have already signed a contract for if I remember correctly was for 248/9 T-90MS units. But I believe it's still good though honestly it's been about 2 or 3 years since I've looked at it.
I just checked the OOB and I see it's UNIT 059 listed as the MS version which would be incorrect. Also unsupported reports claim Russia is operating a " few" unspecified number of T-90AM tanks (Big difference here is it uses a 20mm secondary weapon.) and the intention is to start building them in 2020. This is very sketchy at this point.
It's good to have sources!  And I'll never reveal all of them-sorry-OK not really!?! 
Regards,
Pat
__________________
"If something is not impossible, there must be a way of doing it." - Sir Nicholas Winton
"Ex communi periculo, fraternitas" - My career long mentor and current friend -QMCM/SS M. Moher USN Ret..
Last edited by FASTBOAT TOUGH; March 31st, 2017 at 01:58 AM..
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March 31st, 2017, 02:41 AM
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Lieutenant General
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Join Date: Oct 2008
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Re: MBT's
Ran out of edit time but for clarification...I had believed we originally entered the T-90AM based on some information we had at the time, which to use the same phraseology as in my last, was " very sketchy" and we kept the tank "ready to go" but not available as I always described them as a 999 UNIT.
If I may suggest the following...
A) Inactivate UNIT 059 and keep it as the build model for the export version T-90MS ( SM as sometimes referred to.) until one of those countries actually gets them.
B) Once delivered to the first customer as shown currently or "tweaked" if needed, change UNIT 059 to the T-90AM version as discussed and again in an inactive status until Russia fields it fully as is now planned.
Again the tank is NOT active in any OOB in this game currently. A deal with KAZAKHSTAN fell through about 4yrs. ago.
Russian T-90AM (About as good as there is for now.)...
http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/mo...a/T-90_MBT.php
http://www.military-today.com/tanks/t90.htm
https://southfront.org/russia-milita...f-three-tanks/
Regards,
Pat
__________________
"If something is not impossible, there must be a way of doing it." - Sir Nicholas Winton
"Ex communi periculo, fraternitas" - My career long mentor and current friend -QMCM/SS M. Moher USN Ret..
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The Following User Says Thank You to FASTBOAT TOUGH For This Useful Post:
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March 31st, 2017, 06:51 AM
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Shrapnel Fanatic
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Join Date: Mar 2005
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Re: MBT's
Quote:
Originally Posted by FASTBOAT TOUGH
Ran out of edit time but for clarification...I had believed we originally entered the T-90AM based on some information we had at the time, which to use the same phraseology as in my last, was " very sketchy" and we kept the tank "ready to go" but not available as I always described them as a 999 UNIT.
If I may suggest the following...
A) Inactivate UNIT 059 and keep it as the build model for the export version T-90MS ( SM as sometimes referred to.) until one of those countries actually gets them.
B) Once delivered to the first customer as shown currently or "tweaked" if needed, change UNIT 059 to the T-90AM version as discussed and again in an inactive status until Russia fields it fully as is now planned.
Again the tank is NOT active in any OOB in this game currently. A deal with KAZAKHSTAN fell through about 4yrs. ago.
Russian T-90AM (About as good as there is for now.)...
http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/mo...a/T-90_MBT.php
http://www.military-today.com/tanks/t90.htm
https://southfront.org/russia-milita...f-three-tanks/
Regards,
Pat
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It's is " active " currently in the Indian OOB and was put in a couple years back on speculation it would be in service..... I get bit all the time with stuff like this and it's time I listened to my own advice and NOT ENTER ANYTHING UNTIL ITS ACTUALLY IN SERVICE...so I have little use for any info about " what might be sold to whoever" at all |
April 2nd, 2017, 01:07 PM
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Lieutenant General
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Kingsland, GA.
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Re: MBT's
Well I felt kind've bad about the last post by Don. History has shown that at times equipment I've "reported on" has made it into this game without myself actually having had submitted it to Don. As noted in the past many times and speaking ONLY for myself, our arrangement has been simply if there's strong evidence to support it we'll work within a six month "swag' of the expected fielding date based mostly on including the training/certification of the crews for that piece of equipment as I've recently posted in this thread on the U.S. Army training for the Abrams in response to a question from Don. You don't automatically field a unit without training first unless in time of war and the game does this ( Or did.) when you upgraded tank Y for tank Z IN YOUR CORE UNITS WITH THE EXISTING CREW, you took a small hit in the crews experience level.
This will be the case when India does get and operate the T-90MS. They have very experienced crews that have operated the T-90S for a very long time now and as a reminder they've licensed built the same also for a very long time.
Status thus far for India is the contract has been signed since last November 2016 as also reported by SIPRI they also confirm reports from the web that the deal is worth just over 2 Billion U.S. for 464 units of the T-90MS. India's MOD is pushing hard to get 64 units directly from Russia for immediate deployment to the Pakistani border as there have been several border clashes involving the killing of Indian soldiers at the border. Well Russia has to build them first. No status of delivery of those tanks yet. I can confirm none were delivered by the end of 2016. You should know I'll be watching for developments. My best guess would be around Oct. 2017 earliest.
To my opening section for now on when I post in any of "my" threads you will see as the lead one of or both of the following "tag lines" FYI and Fielded anything under those "tags lines" well means just that and NOTHING ELSE.
Don my apologies if something I posted lead you to entering the tank in India's OOB.
Regards,
Pat
__________________
"If something is not impossible, there must be a way of doing it." - Sir Nicholas Winton
"Ex communi periculo, fraternitas" - My career long mentor and current friend -QMCM/SS M. Moher USN Ret..
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