Design issue report for Scenario #139 Battle of the Beachhead

[SaS TrooP]

Pretty much quick question.
I am replaying some old Lundstrom's scenarios that made me fall in love in this game and apparently scenario 139 Battle of the Beachhead is bugged?

You got Polish naval infantry battalion with some PT tanks. They were absolute elite of the Polish Army back then, but for any apparent reason they seem to kinda be malnourished North Koreans :V
- Entire battalion has NOT A SINGLE RPG (not sure if for any reason but it kinda looks like manually removed or dramatic fault at OOB update and scenario update)?
- They barely have any MMGs - this is general ORBAT error as Polish naval infantry squads did have PKMs and had them plentiful;
- The support sections are incorectly named as battalion (?) HQ Units? Looks like copy-paste option went wrong there
- Same units are armed with 5,45mm RPK? Polish never used those except of some SFs;
- Polish SKOTs are obsolete as of 1989 - 2AP variant was pretty much in use but...
- ...but not in the naval that used OT-62 Topaz for that reason (also with 2AP turrets)
- SKOTs seem to be bought in platoons - probably obsolete solution since only for couple of years Polish Marines get its mechanized equivalent
- Also that battalion seems to be dramatically missing ATMGs and recoiless rifles

Generally the second danish F-16s rape PT tank (and it happens!) entire polish battalion is decimated by simple M113 they have no means against whatsoever.

Either Ulf was having a bad day, or he hates Poles for some reason, or simply several OOB updates and game patches turn this scenario into "nothing is ready sir but we gotta go" situation.

I recommend updating those AT weapons, probably adding some proper battalion level heavy weapons, if not prefferably converting this battalion into mechanized OT-62 based as it should be in reality.

Thank you :V

[Mobhack]

Moved to the correct sub-forum.

Scenario will be looked at.

[DRG]

The issues you are pointing out have N O T H I N G to do with coding so these are NOT "bugs"

This is just a comment on the design of a scenario.

You have made your concerns known. I will leave any correction up to him or you can issue a mod correction of the scenario yourself. These issues go beyond simple OOB changes/corrections.

It does look like he has removed the RPG's ....why is a question only he can answer because there were RPG's in the Naval units he used when the scenario was built 16 years ago but they were removed and just about all the Polish units show being Changed in Scenhack.

[SaS TrooP]

Well this is not my scenario so it would be kinda rude and dicky to change it for Ulf, right? :P

Simply pointing out there are lot of things that does not seem to be looking too reasonably and out of the frames of some typical author changes to the OOB.

[DRG]

It's up to Ulf then. It may be he adjusted the units as he did for play balance.

Anyone can adjust a scenario for their own use if they think it needs an adjustment for whatever reason. An alternate version issued as a mod is fine if it uses a different scenario number as the original and in the text indicates why the mod was made.

[wulfir]

I'm working on it. Map needs a touch up too. I'll need a few days.

Don't remember editing any RPGs out, but it's been a while...

[DRG]

Originally Posted by wulfir

Don't remember editing any RPGs out, but it's been a while...

I checked back to OOB's around the time it was built and the Polish Naval infantry did have RPG's etc.

The txt file for that scenario was created Sept 4.2005 which was the same time as WinSPMBT Version 2.0 was released so it was built with win V1 OOB's and I have a copy of them and they all have all weapons slots filled and all those units show a changed flag in Scenhack.

..........and yeah, it's been a while and I forget a lot of things done in 2005 as well .......it's why we built checks like this into the software ( and why I keep copies of the OOB's )

[wulfir]

Here's an updated version of scn 0139...

Almost everybody on the Player 1 side has an RPG now. More of pretty much everything else too. Some of the equipment is guesswork but judging from info online most of it seems to have been in service with the 7th Division at some point...

I added 82mm mortars to the Naval Infantry Companies. Don't know what kind of transport the Regimental 120mm mortars had but gave them trucks. Also included T-55s and some other stuff. The anti tank company has six ATGMs but is divided into three parts instead of two platoons for better flexibility. Added recoilless rifles to this company too but have no clue how many there were (if any). Player 1 will now have a few PT-76 survivors from the first wave and the full 16 tank company from the 4th Regiment.

The Polish player will have some BM-21s (20 Dywizjon Artylerii Rakietowej)but is otherwise weak in artillery and must compensate with Mig-23 fighter-bombers...

[wulfir]

Also - because of changes made to the Polish 7th Division I opted to change the setting to Aug 1985 and not 1989. I have made a few scenarios early on where WWIII takes place in 1989 but for some time I have used John Hackett's World War III as a sort of frame for NATO vs WP scenarios where WWIII starts Aug 4, 1985.*
*
Here I included information from a now semi-famous map from 1970 ("Plan Operacji Zaczepnej Frontu Nadmorskiego") that details operations of the Polish Coastal Front including what seems to be a seaborne operation against Fakse, Zealand.*
*
(I ignored the nuclear weapons in the plan. Total game killers. )*



https://rucforsk.ruc.dk/ws/portalfil..._5312_1_PB.pdf

Here are the map files used for scn0139. Uses map slot 870.

[SaS TrooP]

Scenario #187 The Fragmented Battlefield also has the Polish infantry equipment issue. Mech rifles are armed with 5,45 RPK74 (not used by Polish army at all except of small numbers in the Formoza) and have no RPGs. Easy prey for Belgian AIFVs :V

Probably inter-patch update broke something here too.

EDIT: Also, about setting stuff in 1985 instead of 1989, there is an issue. There are hardly available NATO detailed ORBATs for that year, and detailed equipment holdings of various Warsaw Pact units by that year are also rather scarce.