diplomacy
 

hi all,

can some explain me if diplmocy is usefull in single player games or is it only useful in multiplayer games.

Re: diplomacy
 

There is no diplomacy in singleplayer, the best way to convince the computer not to attack you is to have lots of pd and a very large army.

Re: diplomacy
 

There is no way to negotiate with the computer players. Computers won't attack you if you have strong province defence near them, will keep fighting with you if you attack them, might stop attacking if you don't attack them, and are very angry indeed if you kill their god, even accidentally.

In multiplayer, some people might try to rush you in the very early game, others ask for a mutual warn-me-3-turns-before-you-attack or no-hostilities-for-20-turns pacts, some sell worthwhile magical items for a price, etc. If you're interested in learning about the multiplayer diplomacy, start following one of the threads in multiplayer subforum. It's all really complicated.

Re: diplomacy
 

NAP+3, kthx?

Re: diplomacy
 

In MP we have also two lines of thoughts, on which we had very on-the-line-of-flaming debates: one on the "thou shalt respect all the treaties you make or your honour will be corrupted forever" and one on the "I'll say we're best friends and then backstab you and steal your girlfriend". So you'll often see separate MP games that say clearly (if the creator makes the things right) if in the specific match the rules allow or not violating Naps and treaties (also called Vegas/Machiavellian diplomacy). The first ones make more strightforward games, the second ones might make the game more chilly, interesting and thematic as you don't know who are really your friends (possibly... none if they see the opportunity ;) ) so... you decide what you prefer!

Re: diplomacy
 

The AI does not seem to respond to diplomacy. But it doesnt mean you cant use it.

Lets say that you have scouted out that you are coming up on nation-A using lots of undead in their armies. And on the far side of nation-A is nation-B who is not doing so well. Having nation-B lose too soon would make nation-A very strong. So you forge things like Herald Lances to send nation-B. It allows nation-B to hold out much longer. Plus, when you finally reach nation-B the fact that they have herald lances is not likely to cause you much trouble.

Sometimes it can even be useful to send gold and gems to an AI that you are not fighting but is on the far side of who you are fighting. Not enough to make them powerful. Just enough to keep them holding out and force your enemy to move armies that direction away from your front.

Remember, the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

Gandalf Parker
--
per peer-pressure preoccupation
My maps, mods, and mullings can be found at
http://www.Dom3Minions.com

Re: diplomacy
 

Well, I thought the 2 competing MP schools of thought were -

All treaties made in game are made by players outside of game - therefore if you break one, you the player, are a bastard.

and:

All treaties made in game are made by in game "pretenders", so don't blame me if my god breaks his word, he's a bastard.


So bottom line - you'll only get so far if you trust everyone once. Best rule of thumb, trust no one, but do what you must to survive, whether in your eyes that means keeping your word, or breaking your word. There are obviously benefits to both, depending on how you reap them.

Re: diplomacy
 

Yeah, unless the OP declares that any agreement entered into is to be binding for that game.

Re: diplomacy
 

Does anyone know whether the AI will use nations you aren't at war with to help other AI nations?

I ask, because in one game out of nowhere an assassin from one AI nation I was nowhere near and had no dealings with tried to assassinate one of my commanders, although I was at war with another AI nation. Or does the AI not consider assassinations to be war?

Re: diplomacy
 

AIs can decide to be at war with you before they have means to move their armies to you. Usually you don't know about this, because nothing happens.

Re: diplomacy
 

There's also an event where a ninja attacks one of your commanders.

The AI usually (always?) sends an declaration of war, unless you attack it. Sometimes, if we don't share a border, I'll forget about it after awhile.

Re: diplomacy
 

Ahh.. the old diplomacy discussion. Let the war begin!

... nah

Re: diplomacy
 

In the beginning of the game, the AI sends lots of declarations of war. But I'm really sure that later on some AIs have attacked me without ever declaring war, and without me attacking it first.

Re: diplomacy
 

I don't know what all counts as a declaration of war for the AI, but the AI will always send a message if it didn't consider being attacked by / at war with the player already.

The AI does consider income of the nations and the border provinces of the player for attacks to seize land, there are some other cases where it does ponder about it as well. If it actually does attack upon the thought of doing so is based on the type of AI.

Starting from turn 40, all AIs will declare war in case the possibility comes up. Before that, a defensive AI is highly unlikely to start war itself, the aggressive one always will. The normal one has a chance in % equal to the turn number.

Re: diplomacy
 

Borders yes.
I do believe that the AI has to "find" you before declaring war. That is most obvious if playing really large maps or even more extreme a tower or pipe map.

What is misleading is that "finding" can be by scout, spy, assassin, seducer. Or later on by spells. So it might seem that the AI is declaring war on you before they could possibly know where you are.

This is verifiable in logs.

Re: diplomacy
 

Ah, I've never experienced this before. I assumed AI Jomon sent one after me, but it's almost certainly just an event.

Re: diplomacy
 

It is an event actually, since it comes up as "an unexpected event happened" message, followed by an assassination attempt.

You get some weird events happening when Jomon is in the game. Instead of barbarian invasions...rhonin/samurai!

Re: diplomacy
 

I don't think Jomon even has to be in the game (it is just a LA alternative to barbarians)

Re: diplomacy
 

Really? Must just be my luck then.