border management and defenses - do you use them? up to what value?

[Ygramul]

How do you manage your borders while you go fight a war in another corner of the map?

I also bring up the defense of the newly conquered provinces to 10. I find that with a decent income bordering provinces can be raised 20 or 30
(sometimes 40 : 30 -> 40 costs ~$350 ). These can hold of moderate armies by themselves while I fight a war on another front. It sucks of course if you loose the war with a 40 defense province as this means loosing $820 worth of investment.

Do you folks instead use local garrisons? Does all this change greatly in the late game? (where I have never been yet)

Yg.

This really depends on the nation you are choosing. The maximum I ever set any provincial defense at is 21. The expenditure of money is not worth it past this point (and even lower for some nations) because you can field much better armies than PD would be able to create. If you have a problem with players snatching your rearmost provinces by either Stealth or spells, I usually change my lines so that patrollers make it harder, or reply in kind with spells to retake them. Alternatively you can have a 'mop up' army that can take care of anything the PD can't handle.

[Wauthan]

Buffing provincial defence by much is sadly a waste of gold most of the time. It's rare that it will be able to do much, save hold of lighter inscursions and perhaps spies.

You really need a fast defending army in order to hold your borders. Provincial defence is simply the backup and canonfodder for this force. Use remote summoningspells to bolster defences if your army is outmanouvered.

Late game you will be pushing huge armies around that no mere militia will hope to stand against. But by this time is usually apparent who is winning and it's time for desperate measures to bring the "pusher" down. Assassins, powerful summoning spells, remote attack spells and clashes of huge armies on multiple fronts decides the outcome by this time. Invest no money in militia except in essential provinces like chokepoints, gem and gold centres and the province were your pretender is hiding.

[ January 21, 2004, 21:13: Message edited by: Wauthan ]

[Gandalf Parker]

Never stop at 10/20/30 because some things are figured that way. Stop at 21 which will make it act in the 21-30 range.

I tend to use 6/11/21/31
I always put at least 1 no matter how poor I am. 6 if I feel its fairly safe. 11 for ones with important recruitable units or labs. 21 for REAL important locations. 31 for castles

This is variable depending on the race. Jotun for instance gets much better results from defense and can run at 3/6/11/21

[Nagot Gick Fel]

In MP I usually buy 5 to avoid enemy scouts claiming my provinces unopposed, it costs only 15 gold and is worth the expense. I buy 10 where I want to deter enemy infiltrations. Sometimes up to 20 for nations that have good militia, like Jotunheim, in inner provinces I want to protect and where I can't recruit local troops (because of low resources). And only 1 for Ashen Empire and Soul Gate, so there's always a leader to lead the dominion-summoned troops.

[Nagot Gick Fel]

Originally posted by Gandalf Parker:
Never stop at 10/20/30 because some things are figured that way. Stop at 21 which will make it act in the 21-30 range.

That's a mystery for me. What's the benefit of "acting in the 21-30 range"?

[Gandalf Parker]

Originally posted by Nagot Gick Fel:

quote:

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Originally posted by Gandalf Parker:
Never stop at 10/20/30 because some things are figured that way. Stop at 21 which will make it act in the 21-30 range.

That's a mystery for me. What's the benefit of "acting in the 21-30 range"?

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Hmmm OK I did a search for it and see that Kristoffer tossed a comment in on that which left it alittle gray.
http://www.shrapnelgames.com/cgi-bin...=000941#000007
Still there is good info in that thread.

[Nagot Gick Fel]

Originally posted by Gandalf Parker:
Hmmm OK I did a search for it and see that Kristoffer tossed a comment in on that which left it alittle gray.
http://www.shrapnelgames.com/cgi-bin...=000941#000007

Ah OK. I thought you meant something about patrol effectiveness. Thanks for the link anyway.

[licker]

Here's one other consideration (I think) when discussing a standing army vs. the PD. You don't pay upkeep on PD, and when PD wins, all losses are regenerated. Actually I'm not 100% sure on either of those, but I'm like 99% sure

Depending on the length of the game and the number of PDs and size of standing armies the initial PD cost vs. the upkeep will have different break points for where its effective and where its not. Thats still an oversimplified view though, as often depending on terrain, your reaction force will still be slow to get anywhere, and sometimes even supplies will be an issue for them. Then again, the reacaion force will probably be stronger than the equivalent amount of PD...

Its a question that isn't quite as simple as some make it out to be. There are circumstances where its simple, but likely more where it isn't so cut and dried.

My 2c anyway

[Master Shake]

The benefit of not having to pay upkeep on the PD is huge. Army upkeep can eat up 80%+ of your income every turn.

Having a real army defend in a province with decent PD is a great asset. I ususally design my unit set up to incoporate the start location of PD units. I leave a gap in hold/attack troops in the center so that the PD cannon fodder can charge out quickly. I want those free infantry units to take the first wave of attacks and spells.

The AI also takes PD into account when deciding who to declare war on and attack. If you have lots of low-PD provinces, good chance you could be the next target.