Pythium and Hydras

tinkthank · #1 February 26th, 2004, 11:16 PM

Since smart folk have pointed out the goodness of hunting blood slaves with scouts, I finally found a use for all those waiting T-Communicants -- yummy blood hunters now, yippee. Having loads of fun with a Fountain of Blood (an odd sentence to utter though it may be), a totally new game for me. Thanks.

But what about Hydras? Who uses them, and how? I havent found a way of using them properly yet. They are slow to transport from the capital, so am I supposed to use them early, or teleport them later? And am I supposed to use them together in battles with my other troops, and if so, how do I keep the rest of my troops from being poisoned? (Doing the obvious, like putting them on different sides of the field, doesnt seem to help much unless I find a way to hire a whole bunch of archers, since eventually all the troops meet somewhere...)

well thanks in advance

Peter Ebbesen · #2 February 27th, 2004, 12:32 AM

Against the AI, at least, try massed Hydras. As soon as you have 5-10 in a group (placed in the middle front rank), it is nearly impossible for the AI to deal with them as they regenerate too quickly. [That should not prevent you from reinforcing with more Hydras as appropriate, just keep producing more of them]. Theurgs should be on the flanks a way back with bodyguards (and you will not be using ordinary troops for anything but bodyguarding here - it is so sad to waste your own men to your own poison). It is so easy it is almost cheating. [Remember to give Theurg communicants some item that can cast an offensive spell and set them to cast spells, or they will mindlessly charge into the fray and die from poisoning]

True, the Hydras do not move that far on the strategic map, but then, they do not need to... Against the AI. One Hydra army in each major theatre can pretty much block anything the AI throws against you.

You can then use an army or two of more mobile javelin troops to halt any incursion that manages to bypass the front lines anyhow.

(Against humans it probably works... Less well... As a human player can use individually targeted killer spells with precision 100 like paralyse, soul slay, incinerate &etc to take out your Hydras one by one)

Gandalf Parker · #3 February 27th, 2004, 02:56 AM

Someone posted a tactic of using one commander with a poison-resistance ring and some 5 Hydras across the front. Position them way forward into the battle. Have them hold 1 turn then retreat. You paint a path of poison cloud that the other army runs thru to try and reach you. One or two of those runs can be a good softener on an army.

st.patrik · #4 February 27th, 2004, 05:51 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gandalf Parker:
Someone posted a tactic of using one commander with a poison-resistance ring and some 5 Hydras across the front. Position them way forward into the battle. Have them hold 1 turn then retreat. You paint a path of poison cloud that the other army runs thru to try and reach you. One or two of those runs can be a good softener on an army.

I experimented with this and couldn't get it to work very reliably.

General Tacticus · #5 February 27th, 2004, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by st.patrik:

quote:
Originally posted by Gandalf Parker:
Someone posted a tactic of using one commander with a poison-resistance ring and some 5 Hydras across the front. Position them way forward into the battle. Have them hold 1 turn then retreat. You paint a path of poison cloud that the other army runs thru to try and reach you. One or two of those runs can be a good softener on an army.

I experimented with this and couldn't get it to work very reliably.

I saw someone using that tactic in MP against indies (I had a scout wathcing the fights). It did work at softening the indies (who had knights), but it also cost the user a few hatchlings and even one hydra when he was being chased. Turning your back on the enemy is not the best of tactics, even if by doing so you poison him...

Playing pythium, I usually start by making a more conventional army. Once that is done, I work on a second army with Hydras, some hatchlings (until I can get 10-15 hydras, which is enough not to get mobbed), and one or two poison resistant commanders. Then I keep 25 gladiators near them, on standby. For easy fights I send only the hydras, for tougher ones I add the gladiators on the front line. Gladiators are cheap, quite good, and have excellent morale : perfect for a disposable force with a punch.

Master Shake · #6 February 27th, 2004, 07:05 PM

For the price of 10-15 Hydras, you could have 10-15 Master Theurg's. They cost a bit more (360 vs 250), but their upkeep is less because they are sacred. I've rather have the Mind Burns/Paralyze/Air&Water magic with 100 precision then some unpredictable poison machine that I can't mix with regular troops in MP.

licker · #7 February 27th, 2004, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Master Shake:
For the price of 10-15 Hydras, you could have 10-15 Master Theurg's. They cost a bit more (360 vs 250), but their upkeep is less because they are sacred. I've rather have the Mind Burns/Paralyze/Air&Water magic with 100 precision then some unpredictable poison machine that I can't mix with regular troops in MP.

They cost "a bit more"??!?!? ~40% is 'a bit'? Anyway, play serpent cult and your Hydrae will be sacred too... then bless them with something cool and watch them stomp even more so than they already do

Besides its really not that hard to manage your Hydrae (well when blessed with at least nature4 anyway...) and not that hard to keep your non poison protected troops away from them on the battlefield, all it takes is some thoughtful planning.

GavinWheeler · #8 February 27th, 2004, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tinkthank:
But what about Hydras? Who uses them, and how? I havent found a way of using them properly yet.

I've used them very successfully (in single player) with a Wyrm no-magic pretender, before getting to the point where I could supplement or replace them with tarrasques. The slow movement rate was a pain, but you can eventually gate them into a convenient location with an ArchTheug.

Edit: when I say "use with", I meant that the (poison-immune) Wyrm was leading them in battle. They made quite a good stand-alone province grabber, with indie strength 8, even against Knights and Longbows. The main army was more conventional troops, and I never tried mixing hydras with non-poison-immune troops.

[ February 27, 2004, 19:02: Message edited by: GavinWheeler ]