Quote:
KraMax said:
unit 543 - IS-2M - made in USSR 1954
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OK, I've been meaning to go over this with you but I've been busy with other issues. I realize that some of what I will discuss differs from the existing OOB's in MBT but that's all going to change in the next patch
There are "western" designations for that series of tank and there are Russian designations and then there are people who use "IS-II" and people who use "IS-2" and people who use "JS-II" and others who use "JS-2"....
.....and all that makes all this so much fun there are no words to describe it
I use "IS-II"
There were a number of developments in the history of the IS-II. I consider the most important one for the purposes of this discussion was the "1944" model. That has been described in various places as being named the IS-IIm ( small m ) or IS-II "1944" OR ( as I now do in the game ) IS-IIm 1944. The gun was upgraded from the D-25 on the early IS-II to the D-25T which used a faster-loading drop breech and a double-baffle muzzle brake. ( the old version of the muzzle brake apparently had an alarming tendency to self destruct )
That is the main model of the IS-II used in WW2 and post war and as I said, it can be called IS-IIm or IS-II 1944 OR IS-IIm 1944 if for no other reason than to attempt to differentiate between that and the early versions.
The IS-IIM ( capitol M ) is the modernization done to the IS-II in the mid 1950's and from all I can find all that was done was there were fittings introduced to add external fuel tanks on the rear hull whereas the basic IS-II had these only on the hull sides along with stowage bins on both sides of the hull and protective skirting along the top edges of the tracks. One source mentions new engines but why add new engines to IS-2's and toss out the IS-III's because of engine problems ?.
Perhaps it was the fact that there were all kinds of IS-II's laying about ?
I have not found anything to suggest the fire control or range finder etc etc was upgraded but that does seem to be a logical thing to upgrade that tank with even if it was only going to be used in second line formations
So. the bottom line here is that "IS-IIm" in the red OOB is NOT the "IS-IIM" modernized version. It's the 1944 version and therefore deserves to be there with that designation.
Which reminds me. I had a look at your Russian OOB and you only have the "IS-2M" in your OOB entering service in 1954. You do not have the pre modernized version ( which really, in game terms is virtually the same tank anyway ) So where were all the IS-2's BEFORE modernization ? I don't think they were rusting away in a field somewhere and I doubt very much they were all pulled out of service before January 1946.
And while you are looking at that see if you can dig up any info on fire control or range finder upgrades done on that mid fifties version.
As well, the history of the IS-III is somewhat clouded in mystery as well. I have read reports they were used in the 1956 Soviet invasion of Hungary and even the Czech invasion in 1968.( though the 1968 does seem a bit of a stretch! ) I have also seen info that they were all out of service by the late 1950's so there is some conflict of information here. They couldn't have been used in Hungary in 1956 if, as you have them in your Russian OOB, they were taken out of service at the end of 1955.
Hopefully all of this will translate correctly. Any info you have would be of interest on these matters
Don
Red OOB
Hybrid Mode
