Please, opinions on upkeeps

[FrankyVas]

I feel like Organics and Radiactives are a wasted resource, even when playing a race with Organic technology, my mineral consumption far exceeds the organic one. I think that organics should be consumed by the population of the empire, perhaps on a 1 to 1 ratio, 1 million subjects consume 1 point of organics per turn. Also, radioactives should be consumed more than minerals for ship upkeep. Perhaps thip upkeep should be 10%M-30%O-60%R or something of the sort.

Your comments are welcomed.

Frank V.

[Tampa_Gamer]

Great Ideal! - Similar to food concept in MOO2 - I like it. You should forward it to Maldador at "malfador@malfador.com"

[This message has been edited by Tampa_Gamer (edited 05 December 2000).]

[Aloid]

It seems that at higher tech levels, the weapons, etc., require more radioactives, so maybe they are not as useless as one would think.

Does someone have a chart to confirm my suspicions?

Aloid

[AMF]

I ABSOLUTELY AGREE!

Sorry to shout. But, I do think this needs to be done...I mean, in at least some form food should be taken into account simply from an empire building perspective - it adds another layer of realism and a new challenge, but a good one.

Alarik

[Talenn]

I long ago altered my data set to make more use of the other two resources. I have Facilities costing FAR more in the Organics department to simulate the need for people and infrastructure. Engines, Missiles, Fighters and many weapons require more Radioactives in my set, giving them a higher upkeep cost in that department. Many facilities also require more in the way of Radioactives and refined goods in my set.

So overall, I have it set so that mass colonization require larger amounts of organics and radioactives. Mass ship building still requires minerals, but the other two are still necessary for long term maintenance.

Also, to facilitate an increased need for these two resources, I greatly reduced the amounts that Farms and Refineries produce. Thus, you have to make more of an investment in them to get the resouces. It works pretty well and I'm pleased with the effects its had in my game. The resources are all important, but for different reasons and at different stages of the game.

Of course this entailed a reworking of the AI's colonies and colony type. Obviously the default settings for them left them with far too few of the latter 2 resource type. I've slowly been tweaking the AI in this regard and it runs a reasonably well-balanced econ at this point. Of course some of its colony decisions are atrocious, but this is beyond the control of what we have to work with, I believe.

One thing I would be hesitant about is the food required/pop thing, for a few reasons.

1) I dont really want to see a return to the MOO model of 'feed your empire'. IMO, its not something that interstellar empires and emperors should be concerned with. Heck, the percentage of people working in food production has been steadily declining in our world as technology increases. IMO, it will be largely a non-issue by the tech levels the game postulates..

2) Population is not really that worthwhile as it is right now in the basic game. Whether or not a colony has 1m or 1000m is largely immaterial IMO. The production bonus is nice, but not make or break. So 'charging' people for their pop seems like a bad idea and one that will encourage people to NOT want to grown their Pop. Thats just my gut feeling, but unless/until pop REALLY means something (like in MOO), having a 'pop-upkeep' sounds like a bad idea to me.

Just my $.02

Talenn

[Taqwus]

A possibly obvious way of requiring more Organic and Radioactive usage would be charging for resupply using these two resources in some ratio.

It's also interesting that repair appears to be completely free. If only car mechanics and plumbers operated that way... although maybe the maintenance cost includes one heck of a warranty and service plan.


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-- The thing that goes bump in the night

[Commander G]

I like the idea of paying maintenance on resupply rather than continuously. How does a ship off in deep space exploration cost its empire upkeep (accrual accounting, I guess)? It should be charged when it returns to port. Worse yet, a damaged, stranded ship that cannot return to port still costs maintenance. In those cases, you head for the nearest black hole or enemy planet to get destroyed!

One big problem with basing maintenance on resupply, is that Units and Space Stations do not consume supplies. I think everything should use supplies and thus require maintenance.

As far as food goes, leave that out of the game. Some races might not require intake of organic substances to live (mobile plants). Lets just consider organics, to be components or supplies that are derived from organic sources such as oil, pLastics, etc.

[greghacke]

i like the thought of consuming organics for a race, but let's not limit it. make it a "consumes: X" on a per race basis. Thus, consuming organics/minerals/radioactives would be free. Consuming nothing would be a racial advantage and cost points...