Dominions Ice Age Contest

[Saber Cherry]

Ok - I think a Dominions Ice Age mod would be fun! But we need an ice age theme for each race, as well as new ice age equipment and ice age indies.

I could, theoretically, do this on my own, but I think it would be more fun, more interesting, and a lot faster if everyone who wants to can participate!

Details:

What is the Ice Age mod theme?

The setting is during an ice age, way before the Ascension Wars timeline, before the invention of ironworking and steel. Some races may have access to Bronze or Copper. Otherwise, only natural non-metals are to be used.

The populations can be more primitive, with different base stats. For example, more HP and strength might make up for the inferior weapons and armors. Blood magic, nature magic, and powerful priests might be more common, while earth, astral and fire might be less so.

If possible, all races should get an inherent forge penalty, but this may or may not be possible.

What is the contest?

The contest is simple:
Propose a complete new theme for a nation! New armors, new weapons, new creatures, and new spells are welcome. One or two people will be in charge of the mod (possibly me, though I'd be more thean willing to hand it over to somebody else...) and decide which stuff is included.

Once the mod is roughly complete, the best new weapon set, best new armor set, best new indy type, best new nation theme, best new spell, best new graphics, and best new descriptions will all be voted on.

Ideally... there could even be a prize for the top new nation (or other categories as well!) That's a fingers-crossed thing, though, not a breath-holding thing.

Current Theme Ideas:

1) "Caelian Ice Age:" Forced Cold+3
Polar bears, sabertooth cats, and killer whales (underwater only - summoning spell). Possibly Snow Golems (special Caelum spell). Caelum's affinity would change from air to water, and the archers would be given ice arrows.

New Capitol special site, The Evergrowing Glacier: Water Mage may Enter to Summon Ice Elementals (size 3).
New Capitol special site, Ice Cave: Ice Drake may be recuited here.

2) Ice Age Man (Man theme)
Iron has yet to be invented. Man uses armors of wood, leather, and fur, and weapons of wood and stone. Large arctic wolves are in the early stages of domestication. Forced Cold+1

3) Ice Age Neanderthals (Ulm theme)
The strong and durable Ulmish ancestors went to battle wearing incredibly heavy stone-platemail armors. Forced Cold+1

4) Ice Age Saurians (Ctis theme)
Large lizards - VERY large. Forced Heat 0 or less (but still coldblooded).

5) Ice Age Abysia:
Similar to modern Abysia, but before the invention of humanbreds. Ceramic chainmails, baked in the depths of the Smouldercone, are worn by the Abyssian Infantry.

Current equipment stat ideas:

//**** Ice Age Equipment ****

//*** Shields ***
name=Oak_Shield aprot=2 def=2 enc=1 hands=1 shield=1 res=2 new=1
//A heavy shield of solid oak.
name=Laminated_Wood_Shield aprot=2 def=2 hands=1 shield=1 res=4 new=1
//A lightweight shield made of many layers of thind wood sheets.
name=Pumice_Shield aprot=0 def=1 hands=1 shield=1 res=1 fireproof=25 new=1
//Pumice is highly fire resistant, but very weak and brittle.
//Shields carved from pumice can protect against arrows, slings, and firey breath, but not heavy melee weapons.
name=Mica_Shield aprot=2 def=2 hands=1 shield=1 res=3 new=1
//When available in large enough sheets, the pliability and laminar nature of mica makes it ideal for shields.
name=Bone_Shield aprot=2 def=3 enc=1 hands=1 shield=1 res=3 new=1
//Needs Description. Made of a solid hipbone?

//*** Armors ***

//Wood
name=Maple_Breastplate aprot=4 def=-1 res=2 new=1
name=Ash_Slat_Cuirass aprot=3 def=-1 res=1 new=1
name=Ash_Slat_Hauberk aprot=5 def=-2 enc=1 res=3 new=1
name=Full_Ash_Slat_Armor aprot=7 def=-3 enc=2 res=5 new=1
//The Ash Slat armors are made of slats cut from ash trees.
//The slats are smoothed, dried, and sewn together like a plank suspension bridge.
//Ash Slat armor is very easy to make but greatly limits flexibility. It is not very strong.

//Laminated Wood Plate
name=Laminated_Wood_Platemail_Cuirass aprot=4 res=4 new=1
name=Laminated_Wood_Platemail_Hauberk aprot=6 def=-1 res=7 new=1
name=Laminated_Wood_Platemail_Armor aprot=8 def=-2 enc=1 res=10 new=1
//The latter 3 are platemails made of laminated wooden plates, sewn together with silk or twine.
//These armors are very lightweight, but their bulk impedes mobility.
//Their laminar construction makes them stronger and less flammable than ordinary wood.
//Creating the many-layered laminar plates is quite time-consuming.

//Grass
name=Woven_Reed_Cuirass aprot=2 res=0 fireproof=-10 new=1
name=Woven_Reed_Hauberk aprot=3 res=1 fireproof=-20 new=1
name=Full_Reed_Armor aprot=5 enc=-1 res=2 fireproof=-30 new=1
//Grass armors are thick woven from tough, fibrous swamp reeds.
//While easy to make, grass is quite vulnerable to flame and piercing weapons.

//Bone
name=Bone_Cuirass aprot=4 enc=1 res=2 new=1
name=Bone_Hauberk aprot=6 def=-1 enc=2 res=4 new=1
name=Full_Bone_Armor aprot=8 def=-2 enc=3 res=6 new=1
//Bone armors are similar in strength to laminar wooden armor, but easier to make.
//They are slightly heavier and much less flexible.

//Flint Plate
name=Flint_Platemail_Cuirass aprot=7 def=-1 enc=2 res=10 new=1
name=Flint_Platemail_Hauberk aprot=9 def=-2 enc=3 res=12 new=1
name=Flint_Platemail_Armor aprot=11 def=-4 enc=5 res=15 new=1
//Flint armors are carved and chipped into crude plates, pierced, and sewn together with twine.
//Stone lacks tensile strength and is more brittle than other materials, so despite its low density,
//the requisite thickness of the plates makes stone armors exceedingly heavy.
//Assembling the armor from plates is fairly simple...
//but mining, chipping, carving, and smoothing make the creation of such armors very tedious.

//Ceramic Chain
name=Ceramic_Mail_Cuirass aprot=6 def=-1 enc=1 res=7 new=1
name=Ceramic_Mail_Hauberk aprot=8 def=-2 enc=2 res=10 new=1
name=Full_Ceramic_Mail aprot=10 def=-3 enc=3 res=13 new=1
//Ceramic Chainmail is formed into links as clay, then fired carefully to keep the links separate.
//Though made of the strongest known ceramic, and fired at the highest possible temperature,
//It is still much weaker metal chainmail. However, it is much easier to make.

//*** Helms ***
name=Wood_Helmet aprot=1 res=1 new=1
//Wooden helmets are carved from a single block, and usually made of softwood.
name=Bone_Helmet aprot=1 res=2 new=1
//Bone helmets are carved from a single large bone, usually near the joint. Whalebone is often used.
name=Ceramic_Cap aprot=1 enc=1 res=2 new=1
//Ceramic helmets must be thick and heavy to withstand weapon blows.
name=Dragonbone_Helmet aprot=2 def=-1 mrst=1 res=5 new=1
//Carved from bones of rarely-found dead dragons, dragonbone armors are exceedingly strong and somewhat magic resistant.
name=Jade_Helmet aprot=1 enc=1 res=3 new=1
//Jade is used for helmets, as it carves more readily than flint, though it is not as strong.

//**** Ice Age Weapons ****

//Clubs
name=Bronze_Mace dam=4 att=0 def=0 length=1 hands=1 hits=1 res=3 new=1
name=Copper_Mace dam=4 att=0 def=0 length=1 hands=1 hits=1 res=4 new=1
name=Stone_Club dam=5 att=0 def=-1 length=1 hands=1 hits=1 res=4 new=1
//Only very strong units can use the stone club
name=Bone_Club dam=3 att=0 def=-1 length=1 hands=1 hits=1 res=1 new=1
name=Wood_Club dam=2 att=0 def=-1 length=1 hands=1 hits=1 res=0 new=1

name=Bronze_Axe dam=7 att=-1 def=-1 length=1 hands=1 hits=1 res=3 new=1
name=Copper_Axe dam=7 att=-1 def=-1 length=1 hands=1 hits=1 res=5 new=1
name=Obsidian_Axe dam=5 att=-1 def=0 length=1 hands=1 hits=1 res=4 new=1
name=Flint_Axe dam=4 att=-1 def=0 length=1 hands=1 hits=1 res=3 new=1
name=Bone_Axe dam=4 att=-1 def=0 length=1 hands=1 hits=1 res=2 new=1
//made from a jawbone
//Lighter than modern weapons, non-metallic axes did not impose a defense penalty.

//Shortswords
name=Bronze_Sword dam=5 att=0 def=1 length=1 hands=1 hits=1 res=4 new=1
name=Copper_Sword dam=5 att=0 def=1 length=1 hands=1 hits=1 res=6 new=1
name=Bone_Sword dam=3 att=-1 def=0 length=1 hands=1 hits=1 res=2 new=1

//Knives
name=Bronze_Knife dam=2 att=1 def=0 length=0 hands=1 hits=1 res=1 new=1
name=Copper_Knife dam=2 att=1 def=0 length=0 hands=1 hits=1 res=3 new=1
name=Obsidian_Knife dam=1 att=1 def=0 length=0 hands=1 hits=1 res=2 new=1
name=Flint_Knife dam=1 att=0 def=0 length=0 hands=1 hits=1 res=1 new=1
name=Bone_Knife dam=0 att=0 def=0 length=0 hands=1 hits=1 res=0 new=1

//Spears
name=Bronze_Spear dam=3 att=0 def=0 length=0 hands=1 hits=1 res=3 new=1
name=Copper_Spear dam=3 att=0 def=0 length=0 hands=1 hits=1 res=4 new=1
name=Obsidian_Spear dam=2 att=0 def=0 length=0 hands=1 hits=1 res=2 new=1
name=Flint_Spear dam=2 att=0 def=0 length=0 hands=1 hits=1 res=2 new=1
name=Bone_Spear dam=1 att=0 def=0 length=0 hands=1 hits=1 res=1 new=1
name=Wood_Spear dam=0 att=0 def=0 length=0 hands=1 hits=1 res=1 new=1


//Ranged

//Ice Age archers shot in straight trajectories, and thus did not have the range of later archers.
//By firing line-of-sight, the damage dealt was based more directly on the archer's strength.
name=War_Bow dam=1 prec=0 hits=1 ammo=10 rng=30 res=3
name=Hunting_Bow dam=-1 prec=1 hits=1 ammo=10 rng=25 res=2
name=Poisoned_Bow dam=-3 prec=1 hits=1 ammo=5 rng=25 res=3 poisondam=5
//head designed to carry a weak poison for killing animals
name=Ice_Bow colddam=7 prec=1 hits=1 ammo=5 rng=30 res=3 pierce=50 magic=1 doesPhysicalDam=-1 doesColdDam=1 strNotAddedCold=1
//Caelians only. Additional freeze effect is possible.

Comments?

-Cherry

[ January 20, 2004, 03:37: Message edited by: Saber Cherry ]

[PvK]

I tend to think wood, skins, bone and textiles would work better than pumice, flint, or mica for armor.

PvK

[Saber Cherry]

Originally posted by PvK:
I tend to think wood, skins, bone and textiles would work better than pumice, flint, or mica for armor.

PvK

I agree
I think I'll put in some easier-to-make "Wood Slat Armor". Suitably stone-age. And bone, of course.

[Saber Cherry]

Ok, I changed the stuff around a bit... haven't deleted anything yet=)

Edit: Relocated replies from CherryMod thread (which will be retained for modding vanilla Dominions). Hope you don't mind, Wauthan!

Originally posted by Wauthan:
Summoning Icedrakes and elementals sounds pretty tough. Maybe if the mages ran a risk of being attacked by something nasty?

Perhaps you could make a Caelum Version of R'lyeh summoning gate? The evercold portal could summon a variety of cold theme creatures with a chance of the mage getting attacked or getting diseased (catching a cold?).

And changing Air to Water will allow them to enter water provinces a lot sooner. Something to keep in mind perhaps.

I want more animal summoning spells.
Claws of winter, 2 nature 1 water 1 air: Summons cold theme beasties.
Waters Call: 3 water 1 nature: Summons water animals like whales, sharks and squids.
Fangs of the Desert, 2 nature 1 earth 1 fire: Summons the likes of snakes, scorpions, camels and vultures.

Perhaps it's because I'm a biologist but an army of animals is too cool to ignore.

Originally posted by Wauthan:
...making (stone plate and wood laminar plate) armor means that they are not exactly on stoneage level of technology and it sort of looses it's prehistory feel.

Making worthwhile armor of such brittle and bulky materials would be a challenge even for the tools of today. And your mod shows that they are well on par with steel armor. But perhaps it's in comparison with the weapons of the time? One could of course jump in and say "it's magic materials" in a fantasy setting but it's sort of stretching it.

Armor made out of skins, furs and bones don't offer nearly the same protection but they are much lighter and would be fast enough to produce to equip a small army.

-Cherry

[ January 19, 2004, 22:16: Message edited by: Saber Cherry ]

[Unwise]

First, I think this is a cool idea. I have a concept I might work on.

But am I missing something? I thought that items modding was not implemented yet.

[Saber Cherry]

Originally posted by Unwise:
First, I think this is a cool idea. I have a concept I might work on.

But am I missing something? I thought that items modding was not implemented yet.

That's correct, item modding is not supported. But it will be before this mod is finished. In the meantime, my combat sim supports item modding, if you want to test the strength of hypothetical items...


Some sample Ice Age indy units:

New Unit:
IA Warrior (Base creature: IA Human)

HP: 11 Str: 11
Prot: 6 Att: 10
Mrl: 10 Def: 11
Mrst: 10 Prec: 10
Enc: 4 AP: 11

Weapons: Wood Club
Items: Oak Shield, Ash Slat Cuirass, Wood Helmet

Gold: 10 Res: 5

*********************************

New Unit:
IA Neanderthal Warrior (Base creature: IA Neanderthal)

HP: 13 Str: 12
Prot: 7 Att: 8
Mrl: 11 Def: 9
Mrst: 9 Prec: 9
Enc: 4 AP: 9

Weapons: Bone Club, Bone Club
Items: Bone Hauberk, Bone Helmet

Gold: 10 Res: 10

*********************************

New Unit:
IA Abysian Inf Axe (Base creature: Abysian)

HP: 15 Str: 13
Prot: 12 Att: 10
Mrl: 11 Def: 6
Mrst: 12 Prec: 7
Enc: 6 AP: 7

Resistances:

Fire: 100 Cold: 0
Shock: 0 Poison: 0

Heat 4

Weapons: Obsidian Axe
Items: Bone Buckler, Full Ceramic Mail, Ceramic Cap

Gold: 20 Res: 20

*********************************

-Cherry

P.S. I noticed that low armor values will make Ice Age units die in droves. I think I'll have to lower the base gold prices=)

[ January 19, 2004, 23:12: Message edited by: Saber Cherry ]

[undead dolphin hacker]

Though it's right off the top of my head, why not include an Ermor variant which is "pre-fall?" Perhaps they could be one of the ones with access to bronze? I say that only because I envision pre-fall Ermor to be Golden-Age Romanesque.

PROS:
-Extremely well-armed troops (ie, Bronze), at least, in comparison to the competition.
-Favors (and is effective with) "basic" tactics--skirmishers in the front or flanks, heavier troops in the center who hold & attack.
-Disciplined, high-morale troops.
-Extremely strong high-level mages.

CONS:
-Weak, if any, missle units.
-Middling priests and few holy units (symbolizes the growing cleft between the church/mages and the state).
-Extremely high gold/resource unit costs (at least, in relation to the other Ice Age races).
-Bronze-clad units are significantly slower than most fielded troops in this period.

And finally, some OTHER ideas:

-Ermor's mages could/should be extremely high-powered, but actually decrease the number of supplies availible to the province they're in--think Nature magic's supply bonus, except in the negative direction. This would symbolize the growing corruption of Ermor's magick.

-Ermor's provincial defense could/should be more expensive than normal.

[EDIT: Fixed terminology.]

[ January 20, 2004, 00:32: Message edited by: undead dolphin hacker ]

[Saber Cherry]

Originally posted by undead dolphin hacker:
Though it's right off the top of my head, why not include an Ermor variant which is "pre-fall?" Perhaps they could be one of the ones with access to bronze? I say that only because I envision pre-fall Ermor to be Golden-Age Romanesque.

Excellent ideas! I didn't consider it at all, but obviously Pythium and Ermor should be united - or else, Pythium would be identical to Ermor, a rebel contigent. Hmmm. I think C'tis and Jotunheim should be the death-Users (C'tis taught Ermor Death magic), and Marignon, Pythium, and Ermor should either be united (called Ermor) or else very similar. Marignon wouldn't really be necessary... it could be an Ice Age Ermor subtheme Or else just a slot for a completely new nation.

-Cherry

[undead dolphin hacker]

If you wanted to keep Pythium, they could be similar to Ermor in low-level units (like Velites, Legionaries (sp?)) but lack the intensely high-morale, heavy infantry that I envision defining IA Ermor.

Lemme make a quick Pythium list so I don't keep rambling:

IA Pythium::

PROS:
-Bronze nation with low-end "cheap" units second only to Ermor's.
-Extremely cheap scouts and assassins, both of which with respectable leadership values (default 15 or 20).
-Cheap provincial defense (peasants pissed off with Ermor aren't hard to find or train.)
-A strong, average-priced, though somewhat inaccurate ranged unit. (Possibly with Stealth?)
-At least one fast, but lightly-armored, ground troop with Stealth.
-Most Pythium troops are quicker than their Ermor counterparts (on par with other IA races--maybe a smidgen slower).

CONS:
-"Military" leaders are neither strong nor cheap, Leadership values don't start very high (25-30?).
-Magic is roughly half as powerful as Ermor's (all the powerful mages figured they'd stay in the well-established Ermor).
-Like Ermor, few Holy units and middling priests (Pythium disagrees with Ermor more on a political level than religious).
-"Basic" tactics aren't very effective for Pythium at all--from a statistical standpoint, Pythium's military is pretty weak.
-Morale is middling to weak, depending on the unit.

"WOULD BE COOL" FEATURES:

-Pythium assassins and scouts can "Levy Malcontents" in any province with NEGATIVE or NEUTRAL dominion--this ability is much like Mictlan's "Levy Slaves", except the produced unit is more powerful, (after all, they're taking volunteer fighters, not enslaving them), and Stealthy (it'd be no better than "Create Unrest" if they immediately attacked. By using "Levy Malcontents," unrest in the province is increased on a level equal to another Scout/Assassin's "Create Unrest" mission. ADDENDUM--if possible from a mod standpoint, it'd be cool if higher Unrest = more levied Malcontents.

-Pythium attempts to "Create Unrest" in a province are 150% more effective than the normal value.

-Pythium armies which are "Sneaking" are only 50% as big as they actually are when it comes to determining whether a provincial defense or patrolling army detects them.

-Pythium armies which are "Sneaking" are 25% harder to detect than average sneaking forces.

COMMENTS:

My vision of IA Pythium is a struggling rebel faction. Ermor has not fallen, if anything, it's reached the height of its power. When Ermor and Pythium are both in a game together, it is assumed that the rebel Pythium faction has just been detected by Ermorian inquisitors, and is thus an identified threat. Pythium keeps Ermor's "cheapo" units--the average grunt at this time is no better and no more loyal than the average mercenary--but loses what makes IA Ermor IA Ermor--the badass heavy infantry.

Instead, Pythium gets weaker, but more versatile, units. March them against most races in man-on-man combat, and you'll lose. Pythium is extremely weak when one plays "chicken" with your opponent's army. IA Pythium is, obviously, a rogueish nation. Use those powerful, if innacurate, (though what ranged unit isn't in the Ice Age?), ranged units for raids and surprise assassinations. Buy up cheap Scouts and Assassins, cause unrestful havoc in the enemy's back yard, then make armies out of 'em if they don't respond fast enough. Fight head-on when you have to, but win through stealth, strategy, and tactics--not sheer force.

[EDIT: Because I spel gud.]

[ January 20, 2004, 01:22: Message edited by: undead dolphin hacker ]

[Keir Maxwell]

If we are talking really Ice Age then I would have though Abysians and C'tis would need to be drastically different as its just too cold for them. Abysia could live underneath the surface perhaps where rivers of Lava raise the temperature.

The nations should probably feel tribal rather than nations in the main. If they still do have something decribable as a nation then this could be a reflection of a very organised, disciplined, response to the Ice Age. I think you would want none of the nations to bear more than a passing similarity to present nations.

As the game will see the development of grand empires, not normally what happens in an Ice Age, it might make sense to set the game at the end of a period of Ice Age with whoevers God wins gets to decide the conditions in the next period - if its Caelum then its more Ice, Man, Pangaea etc then the greening of the world begins while if its abysia then the Lava rivers spout forth as volcanos light the horizens and the world is roasted beneath the fiery light of great sun.



Keir