User Interface Improvments Wanted

[Evil Dave]

While I think that Dominions has a lot of depth, the interface is too clumsy for me to really enjoy the game. While it is possible to do everything necessary to play, many things are ifficult, confusing, or frustrating.

Why is it necessary to click on every solider in an army to find out which ones are experienced, afflicted, or cursed? Why doesn't the game say why a unit can't move to a province? Why can't I disband unneeded units?

I've seen a lot of requests for changes in the interface, but other than the bug list, I haven't seen them collected -- or analyzed, to see if there's some common theme. I've done that.

I believe that the game's main need is to provide more information to the player, although there are few interface bugs and needed features, too. The game should provide more information in three ways: more error reporting, more information at a glance, and more clarity in separating rules from color text.

By more error reporting, I just mean that if Dominions won't let a player do something, it should say why. For example, if I try to assign Manikins to a priest, I'd like the game to say "That unit can't command magic or undead forces." rather than just erasing the highlight and leaving me wondering what's the problem.

Providing more information at a glance means eliminating the need to click on something to find out what it is. I usually run into this with leaders' heroic abilities and afflictions. A little more mouse-over text would help: "Heroic Ability: Heroic Quickness" would be great. I'd also like if the game provided more icons on things -- say, putting experience icons on soliders in the troop setup screen, the same way they're shown on the leader buttons on the main screen.

To separate the rules from the color text (the story at the end of a description), just put the actual in-game effect in the summary. What does a Rat Tail do? The description "Anyone struck by the whip will be hit by overwhelming fear" is pretty vague -- will they flee the battle, fall over dead from fright, or just lose a bit of morale? Compare this to the Skull Standard, which comes right out and says "spell: Panic".

Is it worth it to Illwinter to make these changes? I think so. I think they'll make it much easier to learn the game, and more enjoyable too. This means more players, at least in the long run.In the short run, it's worth at least $49.95 to them, since I'll keep playing the demo until they make at least many of these changes, or I find something else to play.

The rest of this message is a list of the places where I think these ideas will make the game more fun. I also mention a few bugs, and some wanted features. If you don't like lists, skip to the next message.

[*]Main Screen

[*]Leader tiles

[*]Bug fix: the leader tiles have a "hole" in the lower right hand corner that passes mouse clicks through to the map.[*]Make the frame around leader tiles inactive, so that it absorbs mouse clicks rather than passing them through to the map.[*]Bug fix: Ritual spells and forge orders sometimes forgotten if leader looked at, or ritual spell or forge screens opened but cancelled.[*]Option to have all priests Call God.[/list][*]If a unit can't move into a province, say why (not enough raw movement points, unfavorable terrain to move that far).
[*]Remember magic sites seen in provinces (when scouting or in provinces previously owned)
[*]Grey out recruit units button in unowned provinces
[*]Mercenaries:

[*]Grey out mercenaries button if none are available; keep the message to that effect if it's clicked.[*]Highlight mercenaries button if it's time to rehire mercenaries currently employed.[*]Reduce base rehire bid to correct amount (half of base hiring bid)[/list][*]Show disease icon on provinces known to spread disease (magic site, Miasma domain)[/list][*]Cast Ritual Spell Screen

[*]Show icons indicating why spell isn't available (more gems needed, more points in path needed)[*]Provide filters to show/hide various kinds of unavailable spells (more gems needed, etc)[*]Grey out spells not currently available (this is done now, but should keep working with filters)[*]Provide button to alchemy screen[/list][*]Forge Item Screen

[*]Make similar to Cast Ritual Spell Screen, as above. Now, it acts as though it has a permanent filter hiding items not available due to lack of points in a path. Also, curiously, it's the only part of the game that does provide an error message, complaining if there aren't enough gems available for forging an item.[/list][*]Alchemy Screen

[*]Needs to be more generally available via button, not only in Ritual Spell and Forge Item Screens, but any place money is spent, since earth and fire gems can be transmuted into money.[/list][*]Spell List

[*]Search function with various filters (by path, cost, type of spell, etc)[*]Sorting functions similar to above filters[/list][*]Troop Setup Screen

[*]Add disband row at bottom of screen; all soldiers placed here are disbanded at next turn generation.[*]Show icons for afflictions, experience, curses, and starving units[*]Show food usage total for each formation[*]Provide battle setup screen, which shows static image of forces at start of battle. It's sometimes hard to figure out how the overhead view used for positioning formations relates to location in battles.[/list][*]Recruiting Screen

[*]Add alchemy button[/list][*]Battle Viewer

[*]Add typical video controls (back, ff, pause, speed control)[/list][*]Next Turn for Multiplayer Games

[*]Make next turn work like single player: can submit turn then go back
and make other moves or look at battle movies.[*]Add countdown timer showing time until next automatic host update, if autohost is being used.[/list][*]Start game screen

[*]Allow saving multiple gods per race[*]Load specific god per game per race[*]Load god as template into god design screens[/list][/list]
Th-th-that's all, f-f-folks!

Well Dave, it has been said before and it's coming about, slower than most would want.

For now you will be forced (I know it's a hardship, since you spent $49.99 on a game and expect it to be perfect) to wait.

There is a specific resource right now that addresses a few of these issues.

To separate the rules from the color text (the story at the end of a description), just put the actual in-game effect in the summary. What does a Rat Tail do? The description "Anyone struck by the whip will be hit by overwhelming fear" is pretty vague -- will they flee the battle, fall over dead from fright, or just lose a bit of morale? Compare this to the Skull Standard, which comes right out and says "spell: Panic".

There is a magic item quickreference( Illwinter Docs )that fills this gap in the ingame mechanics as of right now. As IW decided to put magic items only in the manual and not a database, it could be said they either didn't have time, or didn't want to make a magic item database akin to the spell database. If the case is time, hopefully they will make a magic item database sometime in the future.

But I'd like to put my own personal comment on a few of these suggestions.

If a unit can't move into a province, say why (not enough raw movement points, unfavorable terrain to move that far).

I believe this is a redundancy. If a player is unable to figure out why he can't move 2 squares because there is a troop that moves slow (movement of 1) or there is terrain in the way, they are pretty far behind the pack as far as even playing this game. What I'd suggest in stead is having a smaller display or even one on the Commander sidebar that would have it's overall map speed based on it's slowest member (Say below their name)

Remember magic sites seen in provinces (when scouting or in provinces previously owned)

This is already implemented, but only the "Spy" unit is able to tell what type of site is in a province without you owning it. Maybe you want better 'spying'.

Show disease icon on provinces known to spread disease (magic site, Miasma domain)

In the case of Miasma, it shouldn't be shown. Also with special magic items and stealth commanders IMO it would detract alot from that unique ability. While being 'information friendly' it shouldn't be directly displayed. For Sites I have no problem with it being shown.

Add disband row at bottom of screen; all soldiers placed here are disbanded at next turn generation.

I believe this is intentional for them to not be disbanded.

Make next turn work like single player: can submit turn then go back
and make other moves or look at battle movies.

You can, you can only not do this if the turn is hosted. There are innumerable times you can go back and redo or replan your movements and choices and watch battles, as long as the turn is submitted before the server hosts.

Add countdown timer showing time until next automatic host update, if autohost is being used.

It is, at the nation selection screen. If you want it in the movements of your turn (the map screen) you should specify. Also the countdown I believe is only in hours if the host schedule is set in hours, minutes if the host schedule is in minutes. Perhaps a more accurate Version can be made for the hourly or daily host schedule, though these are the ones that it's not an issue with you knowing how long you have to play your turn.

[ January 21, 2004, 03:36: Message edited by: Zen ]

[Arryn]

Originally posted by Zen:
I believe this is intentional for them to not be disbanded.

Add it bears repeating then: intentional, or not, not being able to disband units is a major flaw in the game as far as some of us see it. There are nations that can ill afford to be "gifted" by random packs of fanatics and militia, that rout at the drop of a hat, and end up scattered to the nine winds, all the while eating up your precious gold (and food). Folks on this forum say that you can herd them and use them to suicide. Well, it doesn't work. It takes valuable time (and a commander) to try to do that, and they tend to rout before they can be useful by dying gloriously for the good of the faith, taking some enemy heathens with them. It wouldn't be quite so bad if the fanatics were truly that, and had high morale. But they don't.

Occasionally I get "lucky" and a province I've parked a bunch of these near-useless mouths-to-feed gets attacked by a large AI force and every Last one of them gets wiped out before they can rout. But not often. Sigh.

I am not pro or con on the debate of not being able to disband. I have always found ways to either use or throw away those militia or flags. While I agree that that particular event is annoying (and has been reiterated time and time again) it is far from 'nearly useless' and at times they can be incredibly useful while others they are a major pain in the ***. I don't feel the solution to that is in particular adding 'disband' but the modification of that particular event.

And you can get them to suicide Arryn. Try not putting them by themselves, but in a massive squad of troops you have either shoring up a center or on a cavalry flank. You'll find that they won't break and can be killed quite efficently if you want them to, when put up against and sort of reasonable opponent/province.

[Graeme Dice]

Originally posted by Evil Dave:
Compare this to the Skull Standard, which comes right out and says "spell: Panic".

It says panic in that case because it allows the commander to cast the panic spell.

I'm just going to point out the changes I would disagree with.

Bug fix: Ritual spells and forge orders sometimes forgotten if leader looked at, or ritual spell or forge screens opened but cancelled.

That's to let you cancel the order if you change your mind.

Option to have all priests Call God.

Even those ones you have out doing other more important things at the moment?

If a unit can't move into a province, say why (not enough raw movement points, unfavorable terrain to move that far).

I'd definetly want to turn this one off right away.

Remember magic sites seen in provinces (when scouting or in provinces previously owned)

It already does this.

Show disease icon on provinces known to spread disease (magic site, Miasma domain)

Sites that are known to the player could show this. Miasma should not, as that would give you information on both what theme the C'tis player is using, and who the owner of the positive dominion is.

Show icons indicating why spell isn't available (more gems needed, more points in path needed)

A lack of skill is already indicated by the spells being grayed out.

Add disband row at bottom of screen; all soldiers placed here are disbanded at next turn generation.

I don't believe that there is any intention on the part of Illwinter to allow you to disband your troops. If you want to get rid of them, you have to send them on suicide missions in squads by themselves.

Make next turn work like single player: can submit turn then go back
and make other moves or look at battle movies.

It already works like this.

Add countdown timer showing time until next automatic host update, if autohost is being used.

This also already exists.

[PvK]

Originally posted by Evil Dave:
...
Why is it necessary to click on every solider in an army to find out which ones are experienced, afflicted, or cursed? ...

It's not necessary; you can click on one unit in a group, and then hit "W" to highlight/select all the afflicted ones.

As for flagellants, there were some people at one point suggesting they were an uber-unit, when blessed. They aren't cowardly at all if they have a priestly leader around to cheer them up with Blessing (+3 morale) Surmon of Courage, Fanaticism etc., and for pretenders who start out with magic paths at 4+, the blessings also give them other powers which can make them into pretty effective units, which I don't expect cost any gold to maintain (do they?), since they were volunteers.

PvK

[Evil Dave]

Originally posted by Graeme Dice:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Evil Dave:
Compare this to the Skull Standard, which comes right out and says "spell: Panic".

It says panic in that case because it allows the commander to cast the panic spell.

---

Right. So why can't everything have a concise description? I've gotten tired of the recent trend in games where the game-within-a-game is "guess what the moves do". There are times when the exact effect is either below the level of abstraction of the game or is intentionally random, but I can't see why a god with incredible magic powers wouldn't know what his spells or magic toys do.

Oh, and thanks, Zen, for the pointer to the reference. Still wish it was in the game.

quote:

---

Bug fix: Ritual spells and forge orders sometimes forgotten if leader looked at, or ritual spell or forge screens opened but cancelled.

That's to let you cancel the order if you change your mind.

---

Sure, but from an interface design standpoint, there's already a cancel option: defend.

quote:

---

Option to have all priests Call God.

Even those ones you have out doing other more important things at the moment?

---

It's an option. I don't mean that it should replace the one-at-a-time commands.

quote:

---

If a unit can't move into a province, say why (not enough raw movement points, unfavorable terrain to move that far).

I'd definetly want to turn this one off right away.

---

I think I like Zen's suggestion of displaying army movement limits with their commanders better than my proposal.

quote:

---

Show disease icon on provinces known to spread disease (magic site, Miasma domain)

Sites that are known to the player could show this. Miasma should not, as that would give you information on both what theme the C'tis player is using, and who the owner of the positive dominion is.

---

Oops. My mistake. I thought domain type was public knowledge, but I see that it isn't. That's a symptom of playing several sides at once to test stuff.

quote:

---

Add disband row at bottom of screen; all soldiers placed here are disbanded at next turn generation.

I don't believe that there is any intention on the part of Illwinter to allow you to disband your troops. If you want to get rid of them, you have to send them on suicide missions in squads by themselves.

---

Somebody is going to have to explain this one to me in small words. I'm playing a god. If I want Bob the afflicted, cursed, and otherwise useless fanatic to go back to his farm and fanatically till his fields, I expect him to obey.

quote:

---

Make next turn work like single player: can submit turn then go back
and make other moves or look at battle movies.

It already works like this.

---

Hm. Wasn't obvious to me. I may just be stupid.

quote:

---

Add countdown timer showing time until next automatic host update, if autohost is being used.

This also already exists.

---

But not in the main screen, where I'm spending most of my time. I tried a blitz game (five minute turns) with a few friends, and several of them missed turns because they simply didn't notice that five mintues had gone by. Since I had the server running in another window, this wasn't a problem for me.

[Graeme Dice]

Originally posted by Evil Dave:
I think I like Zen's suggestion of displaying army movement limits with their commanders better than my proposal.

This would be very useful.

Hm. Wasn't obvious to me. I may just be stupid.

Just click on the name of your nation again, and it will ask you if you want to continue or restart.

But not in the main screen, where I'm spending most of my time. I tried a blitz game (five minute turns) with a few friends, and several of them missed turns because they simply didn't notice that five mintues had gone by. Since I had the server running in another window, this wasn't a problem for me.

You could also put the server on quickhost, or hit the host button after everyone finishes, but I see the reason for putting this somewhere in the main interface.

[Saber Cherry]

I don't think "Disband" is necessary. Not for a god. The god should be able to snap its fingers and watch'em die... best for Ermor, who needs the corpses, of course

Note that a decent solution would be to make all volunteer units minimal upkeep (1/5 of normal, just enough to survive). Seems reasonable...

[ January 21, 2004, 05:09: Message edited by: Saber Cherry ]

[Arryn]

Originally posted by Saber Cherry:
Note that a decent solution would be to make all volunteer units minimal upkeep (1/5 of normal, just enough to survive). Seems reasonable...

One-fifth would be acceptable to me. However, if we wanted to invoke that ugly term 'realism', they should cost no upkeep, as they should be considered to be a mobile variation of PD.