scripts during assassinations

tinkthank · #1 April 28th, 2004, 05:02 PM

I like to give my mages, particularly those support mages, specific scripts they'll use for a while.
I notice, however, that these scripts are still used when someone tries to assassinate you. Things like Arrow Fend become pretty silly, where I'd much rather have them cast Summon Nasty Things.
Any tips on a workaround?

Gandalf Parker · #2 April 28th, 2004, 05:25 PM

Hmmm coming in I thought it was about scripting the assassin (which many people neglect).

Scripting the victim? The only thing I can think of is assign bodyguards, or give them summoning items (like that little skull)

Endoperez · #3 April 28th, 2004, 07:58 PM

Improving the AI for special cases (being assasinated or being assaulted by an army) is not that bad an idea. It would include quite a bit of work, though. WHAT should your mage have done? Army Boosters shouldn't be casted, of course, and summoning spells should have increased value. Would this lead a Death Mage summoning Lammahsthas if you haven't yet researched Enchantment? Should AI use 100-prec spells that allow MR-save or try 'normal' spells that will surely kill the lonely guy if they hit?

If ideas are discussed, the ones developers like will propably end up in the game...

Jondifool · #4 April 28th, 2004, 09:22 PM

Not sure that improving the AI is the most needed feature in this case. Does mages need to be stronger against assasins?

Firebreath · #5 April 28th, 2004, 09:51 PM

A logical conclusion might be that if you leave you wiz without guards, it is just the same as leaving him without the right spells. A careless oversight. A fatal one no doubt. Does the A.I. really need to compensate for human oversight?

As far as scripting (normal, non-mage) assassins - what can you do? Fire a few crossbow bolts and then close in for the kill, if you think you're facing a standard leader, and you've bothered to equip your assassin with a bow? (an unlikely combination, I suppose). Do placement orders work in assassinations, or does victim/assassin always start at equidistance to each other?

If you've empowered your assassins in astral magic, then sure, there are all sorts of interesting things that you can do

Yossar · #6 April 28th, 2004, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Firebreath:
If you've empowered your assassins in astral magic, then sure, there are all sorts of interesting things that you can do

R'lyeh assassins start with 1 Astral and C'tis assassins get 1 Nature and 1 Death.

Zapmeister · #7 April 29th, 2004, 05:16 AM

Quote:

A logical conclusion might be that if you leave you wiz without guards, it is just the same as leaving him without the right spells. A careless oversight. A fatal one no doubt. Does the A.I. really need to compensate for human oversight?

It's not an oversight. You need to give your mages appropriate army-combat spells if you want them to participate effectively in army combat. The problem is, there's no way of telling them how to behave differently if they are subject to assassination attempts in the same turn.

The whole assassination thing is a bit cheezy, though. I mean, what kind of assassin does his job by charging at the victim from the other end of a battlefield? To do it properly, you need a model completely separate from the one used for army combat.

Cheezeninja · #8 April 29th, 2004, 05:35 AM

haha... suddenly a gap opens in the milling minions, an assassin charges through! None of the minions have been ordered to guard a commander so they grab some popcorn and get ready for a show, the assassin and the commander face off, 30 paces in between them.... its time for a showdown.

Chazar · #9 April 29th, 2004, 10:58 AM

Umh, I always thought that the reason that assassinations are calculated like battles was saving illwinter the pain to think about another battle mechanism.

I think the way it is, the chance for successful fighting assassinations are quite right - if not too good to really use assassins. So I would be happy if an indoor background would be displayed in the battle view. Nothing more, nothing less.

(On the other hand, a seperate mechanism for assassinations would be nice, since then units on guard could be allowed to fire missile weapons in ordinary combats, which was prohibited since it would make fighting off assassins way to easy, if recall some older threads on this forum here correctly...)

Chris Byler · #10 April 30th, 2004, 06:19 PM

I don't think that's why bodyguards can't fire. It's trivially easy to make assassins resistant to normal missiles, so only Illithids would be "too effective" bodyguards - but Illithids cost 50 gold apiece, and even then they can be resisted by high MR.

I think most assassins are too weak at the moment - they lose pretty quickly. They're somewhat effective against expensive mages that take no countermeasures against them (including bodyguards); relatively ineffective against normal commanders (too much of a crapshoot for the cost); and worthless against strong fighting commanders like Knights, Paladins, Minotaur Lords etc.

Unless you equip them with dozens of gems worth of magic items, in which case they still sometimes get killed and you lose that whole investment.

The ability to disrupt an army's movement if you succeed is good - if you succeed - but unreliable.