Return of the raptor ... have they really returned

[Pocus]

Frankly I'm starting to wonder if anybody ever tried to play with RorR in a pbem (aka competitive) game. The theme beg for a boost, and nothing is done patch after patch. I'm particularly not understanding how the black guard can cost 17 gp for such crappy stats.

[Kristoffer O]

Hello Pocus and welcome back. They are probably unfixed because you haven't been picking on us lately

They do need some changes, but we've had much to do lately. I have some new ideas, but other matters have taken my attention from the poor ravens. Good that you bring them up again.

[Pocus]

Hi again Kristoffer,

A note about some of us who are not posting regularly on Shrapnel...
1. We now post partly on the pc4war forum, in french, and to help the french community thrive more and more (the paper mag already published 4 articles on dom, and we're writing a new one (8 pages!) for the next month).
2. We are still playing much your (unequaled) game in pbem and in solo. In fact Dom is still my favorite game since I started playing it, 2-3 years ago.

Now about the subject of the post. I must confess I was surprised by the lack of major updates in the new patch. Not that I'm *****ing on you, I know that you have the right to do other things in your life! But I was wondering if it meant you were on a secret project (a new game, a kind of expansion pack / super patch, etc.) ...

RotR is weak. There is some salvation in the Harab Seraph, who is a nice tool for spells like Summon Valks, but there is too many weaknesses in the theme. Perhaps you should consider adding a random magic on a mage, give the sacred status to the Black raptor (without changing the cost as he is darn overpriced), and/or give a new benefit to the race so that there is some unique interest in playing it... Whatever. But tweaking some value take only an handful of minutes, and it is safe to say that (say, its an example) reducing the cost of the guard to 13, cant move the theme to super-theme status!

have a nice day!

[Nagot Gick Fel]

I'd like to know what's the rationale behind giving earth magic to Raptor mages. I remember there's something about a 'need for steel' in the Harab Seraph description, but nothing more. Everyone needs steel, so that sounds like a weak excuse to me. I'd have preferred the Harab Seraphs to come with either 2 air+1 death or 1 air+2 death. As they are, they're not really useful on the battlefield before you get Alteration 6. Seithkonur have similar magic skills at the same price, but their magic skills work much better together.

[Kristoffer O]

Pocus:

It's OK. I occasionally visit the pc4war forum, but my french is limited. I'm of the opinion that it is a very good forum with serious discussions. We thank you for that!

I would like to see some of the later articles. I've only read the first two. I must say that the magazine is the most impressive computer gaming magazine I've seen.

***** on! We're doing other things, but you do not need to worry. We work for you. You just dont know it yet


Något:

The need for steel thing is about caelum mages being crafters of weapnonry. At first out of ice and later out of metal when the thaw set in.


Both fransoses:

There are several things that make RotR weak. More expensive mages without random and weaker combination of paths combined with priestly cost. And there are fewer useful combinations of earth death and air.

[Endoperez]

I'd love to see a Frankenstein mod giving Corpse Men more hitpoints, more skills as the parts were taken from elite soldiers, more strength and more natural protection, and maybe both "does not heal" and "magical unit" -attributes so that it repairs itself at friendly lab.

Its weapon (fist!) is pretty bad, too. Maybe it should be changed fot the claws Ghoul has, for paralyzing poison? I can put this together, but as I don't have time or skill to playtest it I won't bother if no one else is interested.

[Truper]

While it's true that there isn't any reason one would choose Return of the Raptors over base Caelum, RotR is still the 2nd best nation for False Horror spam - the cheesiest tactic in Dom2. This means that RotR is a very powerful nation. Why would one even dream of summoning Valkyries when False Horrors are available?

[Tuna]

Truper said:
Why would one even dream of summoning Valkyries when False Horrors are available?

'cos even the weakest of the area-of-effect spells burn trought false horrors like they wouldn't even be there. Not that valks are much better...

What about the following (basic) changes :
- reduce cost of Seraph to 120 (base Caelum has exactly the same unit for only 100 AND it is not capital only),
- add the indep Harab Seraph with Death2 as recrutable unit (not limited to capital).

If you can make some more changes I suggest :
- add a small research bonus (+2 RP) or a small forge bonus (-10%) to the AED Harab Seraph (it could be then renamed as "Ravens Smith" or "Ravens Sage"),
- add an unique hero, Ramsus, a huge Corpse Construct with 100-110 hp, without magic but able to make one or two Corpse Construct/t (as "sommon allies").
just my 2 cents...

[Liadran]

If you want to make changes to Raptor mages then there are few options around. Now the problem is that to use that earth well it'll take attention from Pretender design as it's hard to get earth enhacers with Earth-1. Earth is also very very usefull for Raptors.

If you want to change the mages then following is possible:
Harab Seraph:
Death-2, Air-1
no research bonus needed, it's one of the quickest researchers in the game already

Harab Elder:
Air-2, Death-2, Earth-2
Air-2, Death-2, Earth-1, Random-1

This setup makes Earth magic more usable without reducing the so needed Death magic for Raptors. From those Elder choices the one with random is better as it keeps still the possibility for Air-3.

About Ravens Guard. Ravens Guard is simply the most effective unit for Caelum in my opinion. I admit that those stats are a bit low though. But the point being that Ravens Guard is an offensive unit with 2 attacks and dealing more damage than either Storm Guard or Iceclad. I think that the price is also decent one as it takes a lot less resources compared to those other 2 choices (and guarantees move of 3). Storm Guard and Iceclad even with their nice armor won't be dealing a lot damage and can't stand in a few turns of fighting. Size 3 and flying attack spreads them over a large are and they are just moped down and then retreating off the field. Ravens Guard can (especially with the help of some Earth magic) deliver a blow that is enough to win that brawl.