Problem Saving Games - Page 5

Mortibus · #41 October 12th, 2006, 09:56 PM

Games are designed on the premise of not saving and reloading.

It may sound off to you guys, but there are people out there that enjoy games like "Roguelike" where save and reload is not an option... it makes the game more challenging.

Roguelike is linked from this webside, I would assume because the programmers enjoy that game. That game has no save and load feature.

No one makes me save and reload, indeed. No one makes you play a game where you cannot save and reload conveniently, ya?

KissBlade · #42 October 12th, 2006, 10:06 PM

Last time I checked, this is a save and reload game. You just need to specifically save the folder if you choose to save a specific turn. The ability to save your turn and reload of your choosing doesn't make the game any less challenging. (since as many people declared you can a) mod troops very easily and win and b) you can save the folder anyway) As said, the ability to save costs you /nothing/ if you choose not to activate it. However, to suggest that someone should just not play the game because of a lack of save optiono is ridiculous. Dom III isn't at that point of the market yet where it can say "well [censored] the customers". The annoyance of what a save and reload option will cause you should be far less significant than it's appeal to people who desire one.

Frostmourne27 · #43 October 12th, 2006, 10:08 PM

Quote:

KissBlade said:
Save and Reload can appease both types. If you're a stickler, then just don't use it. Simple as that. Unless you're saying you don't like it because you'll want to reload? That makes little sense to me actually. And to say "The save and reload fans have enough games already, don't you think?" just sounds a little off to me.

That is pretty much what I'm saying. It's not that I'm 'weak-willed' (a better test of willpower would be like, refraining from personal atacks on the forums for a week or two) it's just that I don't want that option. It's like saying DnD is too easy: play without a cleric. I want to use all the options out there. I don't want this as an option because I don't want to be paying for a game that has features that are (IMHO) spurious and unneeded - that would be a waste of the developers time, my money, and my time. Would you be happy if Dom3 came with a 500$ gold ingot attatched, and you had to pay an extra 500$? even though gold prices are rising and you could maybe offset the extra expence of shipping it all the way to wherever?
When people complained about the lack of difficulty in Heroes of Might and Magic 5, Nival's lead developer suggested playing without saving/reloading. People were furious, saying that it was a demonstration of the grossly capitalistic game industry that tries to make money, not games. Atleast Illwinter isn't like that. However, they aren't conventional. They do some strange things.

This concept, along with the idea of allowing certain spells to be banned from cast by mages, has been around for quite a while, and is fairly simple to implement, I think that they probably look upon it as a bad thing.

Theonlystd · #44 October 12th, 2006, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Mortibus said:
Games are designed on the premise of not saving and reloading.

It may sound off to you guys, but there are people out there that enjoy games like "Roguelike" where save and reload is not an option... it makes the game more challenging.

Roguelike is linked from this webside, I would assume because the programmers enjoy that game. That game has no save and load feature.

No one makes me save and reload, indeed. No one makes you play a game where you cannot save and reload conveniently, ya?

i enjoy and regularlly play rogue likes. But That Rogue like game doesnt involve me remembering my 20 armies placed over 100 provnces and the building of new armies and assembling of those new armies,then orders for them while remembering to set research,spells and everything else for my 80plus mages... Im not wanting to reload to save my army cause the Ai was just better than me that time.. But cause i have a hetic life and forget things from time to time

And thats just stupid. Illwinter is in the market to make money. So your saying poeple would would like saving and reloading just shouldnt buy the game? Instead of you just not using that feature.

That makes perfect sense

KissBlade · #45 October 12th, 2006, 10:15 PM

Exchanging $500 dollar gold ingots and ignoring a save/reload option are not apt analogies. And Heroes of Might and Magic 5 is a totally different game because it was too easy because the AI was inept. To suggest playing without saving/reloading would've made very little difference.

Mortibus · #46 October 12th, 2006, 10:18 PM

I get what you are saying... I'm just trying to explain why it is not an easy UI feature in this game.

It's a niche game for a reason, right? I would assume this is one of those reasons. The programmers got the exact same complaints with D2, and yet they decided deliberately not to include save/load as a feature.

They want an ironman game. They're not doing it to spite people, that's just the kind of game they wanted to make.

If they wanted a mass market game to get more customers, it would be a 3D RTS with a convenient autosave, ya?

I'm sure there well be a download shortly that will resolve the save issue for you. I would like the option myself in case of a corrupted save file, at least a named save on exiting the game.

Frostmourne27 · #47 October 12th, 2006, 10:25 PM

Quote:

KissBlade said:
Exchanging $500 dollar gold ingots and ignoring a save/reload option are not apt analogies. And Heroes of Might and Magic 5 is a totally different game because it was too easy because the AI was inept. To suggest playing without saving/reloading would've made very little difference.

What (should) make a game difficult other than AI? A game should be sufficiantly hard that losses vs. the AI are common (like maybe 30-40% of the time) but it should allways be close. As for the analogy, it's not the greatest, but it's not too bad, even if it's far fetched: It's an added 'feature', since it is basically decreasing the eventual cost of the game, but it isn't really something that many people will want. The differance (other than the rediculous scope of a 500$ gold ingot) is that MOST people want save games, whereas most people don't want to become envolved in speculating on the prcie of gold.

Theonlystd · #48 October 12th, 2006, 10:38 PM

Quote:

Mortibus said:
I get what you are saying... I'm just trying to explain why it is not an easy UI feature in this game.

It's a niche game for a reason, right? I would assume this is one of those reasons. The programmers got the exact same complaints with D2, and yet they decided deliberately not to include save/load as a feature.

They want an ironman game. They're not doing it to spite people, that's just the kind of game they wanted to make.

If they wanted a mass market game to get more customers, it would be a 3D RTS with a convenient autosave, ya?

I'm sure there well be a download shortly that will resolve the save issue for you. I would like the option myself in case of a corrupted save file, at least a named save on exiting the game.

Uh hows it not an easy UI feature? I managed to add saving and reloading to a crappy game with just book knowledge in Visual Basic.. Its not brain surery esp since evidently someone managed to make a 3rd person mod in dom2 do it.

And yes they didnt do it. And im saying i wish they'd add it.It can still be an ironman game. No one is forced to use it.

If illwinter wasnt in this for the money it would be freeware right?

And yes im sure a 3d party mod will fix it. Just would of be handier to allready have it in game

Mortibus · #49 October 12th, 2006, 11:07 PM

I wasn't talking about the difficulty of programming the save/load UI feature at all, that's easy.

It's a weird game, they aren't catering to the mass market despite the fact that it is not freeware.

Maybe they'll let us know why they didn't include the save/load option. Did they ever address this in the D2 forum?

Twan · #50 October 12th, 2006, 11:25 PM

Quote:

No one makes me save and reload, indeed. No one makes you play a game where you cannot save and reload conveniently, ya?

I'm very neutral about a save feature, as I've said I prefer to see Kristofer spending time on the game system than on this kind of things, I rarely want to save and if I want to save I can copy/paste files. But I find the anti-save arguements more and more ridiculous.

Nobody (except you perhaps) play dominions because they cannot save and reload. People play dominions because it's the best game in the fantasy TBS genre. Not having a save game option is not a "game feature" but an annoyance for some players... and nothing for most others.