Valentine Tanks in NW Europe 44

[Ziploc]

Does anyone know whether the latter versions of the Valentine tank saw service in British tank brigades in north-west Europe from June 1944 onwards?

[JohnHale]

Can't give you definite proof, but I think not. British forces seemed to consist of Sherman/Cromwell/Churchill as fighting tanks only; there may have been a few Valentine bridgelayers, though.

[Mobhack]

Originally Posted by JohnHale

Can't give you definite proof, but I think not. British forces seemed to consist of Sherman/Cromwell/Churchill as fighting tanks only; there may have been a few Valentine bridgelayers, though.

I cannot find anything on this (apart from a wakypedia article which states they were not in use later on).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valentine_tank

But it would seem sensible to have them in their own formations post say Sicily (?) for far-East only/training formations usage. Not sure if any were used in Italy at all.

Any supporting information would be welcomed.

Andy

[JohnHale]

Found this info on the Missing-Lynx site:

http://www.network54.com/Forum/47208...+BC+Valentines

and

http://www.network54.com/Forum/47208...C+3-men+turret

Valentines were issued as Troop Commander's vehicles for Batteries of Archer TDs.

So it looks like another Formation for the Canadian OOB is warranted.

[DRG]

The Valentines already are in their own formations in the British OOB starting 1/44 and disapear from any mixed CS or infantry tank formation at the end of 3/44. The need for a new CDN formation is debateable without knowing how widespread the practice was of providing these to Archer Troop Commander's . I'm betting these were surplus Brit Vals that were just gathering dust in England


Don

[cbo]

Originally Posted by Mobhack

I cannot find anything on this (apart from a wakypedia article which states they were not in use later on).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valentine_tank

But it would seem sensible to have them in their own formations post say Sicily (?) for far-East only/training formations usage. Not sure if any were used in Italy at all.

Any supporting information would be welcomed.

According to Peter Browns tables of tanks in 21st AG, the only Valentines in NW Europe in June 1944 were bridgelayers, 33 in all with 8 in reserve.
By the summer of 1945, there are only three bridgelayers in service with another 10 in depots. Also in depots are 60 Valentine DD tanks. There were 16 Valentines with 6-pdr guns and 16 with 75mm guns in service with 9 of the former and 46 of the latter in depots, These gun-armed Valentines were found in infantry divisions, suggesting that they might be those issued to A/Tk battalions equippes with Archers.

With regards to Italy, Pete Andrews have some tables on his page wich might be usefull: http://www.btinternet.com/~latok/

Claus B

[redcoat2]

The book ‘AFV Profile 6: Valentine Mark III’ has the following to say about the use of Valentine type tanks in NW Europe:

“The Valentine chassis was also adapted for a number of special armoured vehicles and self-propelled mountings. Of the specialised armour the Valentine Bridgelayer was operationally the most important: these were issued on an establishment of six per armoured brigade equipped with cruiser or medium tanks and were used in Italy, North-West Europe and in Burma.”

“The Valentine, although by 1944 armed with the 75mm gun, had been rendered obsolescent … However, it was found still possible to give them a useful role as battery commanders’ vehicles – retaining full armament – in self-propelled 17pdr anti-tank regiments equipped with Archers, which were themselves developed from the Valentine … In this function the Valentine was in at the final stage of the war in Europe.”



The top right and bottom pictures show a Valentine XI used as a command vehicle in a Corps Anti-Tank Regiment, Royal Artillery, North-West Europe 1944-45.

The Valentine was also used elsewhere later in the war. A small number of Valentine DD tanks were used in Italy in 1945 and the 3rd New Zealand Division used some Valentines – some of which were armed with 3-inch howitzers - during their operations in the SW Pacific in 1944. A squadron of Valentines was also used for the defence of Gibraltar.

[Ziploc]

Thanks for the info. From a variety of sources it looks as if only a handful of Valentines were employed in Europe following D-Day. While production continued into 1945 I think the lucky Soviet forces received the bulk of them!