Taxing

[Fantomen]

I want my minute and 48 seconds back right now!

[Quitti]

Originally Posted by Fantomen

I want my minute and 48 seconds back right now!

Apologies from my behalf, you can have your (108sec/9 posts = 12 sec per post) 12sec back. There you go.

[Psycho]

I did some testing and:

Without any taking of provinces:

Treasury(i+1) = Treasury(i) + income(i) - upkeep(i+1)

That is, each turn treasury is increased (or decreased) with the difference of last turn's income and this turn's upkeep.


When nation A takes a province from nation B:

Nation B gets income reduced by the amount the taken province earned (as expected).

Nation A gets income increased by an amount that I could not determine. It is not:
a) the amount nation B lost
b) the amount that the province shows as income when captured
c) the amount of income the province would have with the new owner and taxes set to what the previous owner set (including taxes set at 100%)

[Omnirizon]

Originally Posted by Psycho

I did some testing and:

Without any taking of provinces:

Treasury(i+1) = Treasury(i) + income(i) - upkeep(i+1)

That is, each turn treasury is increased (or decreased) with the difference of last turn's income and this turn's upkeep.


When nation A takes a province from nation B:

Nation B gets income reduced by the amount the taken province earned (as expected).

Nation A gets income increased by an amount that I could not determine. It is not:
a) the amount nation B lost
b) the amount that the province shows as income when captured
c) the amount of income the province would have with the new owner and taxes set to what the previous owner set (including taxes set at 100%)

therefore, if nation A takes province b from nation B on turn t, and sets taxes to 200% on turn t, but then nation B retakes province b on turn t + 1, nation B does not get income(taxes = 200%), but rather gets some as of yet to be determined amount. thus, it is worthwhile to set taxes to 200% whenever a province is captured for which the capturing nation doesn't expect to hold for more than t + k turns, where k is a small constant under which it is worthwhile for the capturing nation to set taxes to 200% for?

OK. makes perfect sense.

[Psycho]

Originally Posted by Omnirizon

therefore, if nation A takes province b from nation B on turn t, and sets taxes to 200% on turn t, but then nation B retakes province b on turn t + 1, nation B does not get income(taxes = 200%), but rather gets some as of yet to be determined amount. thus, it is worthwhile to set taxes to 200% whenever a province is captured for which the capturing nation doesn't expect to hold for more than t + k turns, where k is a small constant under which it is worthwhile for the capturing nation to set taxes to 200% for?

OK. makes perfect sense.

Exactly.

I just wish I could find a formula for the undetermined amount.

[thejeff]

From the situation without taking or losing provinces it seems that changes in income due to dominion/scale changes and unrest affect future income but not current income?

Did your test province have neutral dominion and scales? That would affect income for the different nations.

[chrispedersen]

I don't understand the problem.

On turn(i) you conquer a province. The act of conquering it increases the unrest, and may result in the owner of the province having or not having dominion.

Are you saying that the the modifications for unrest (and possibly dominion switch) do not explain the income received?

[vfb]

100% expected income from province B implies no unrest or scale effects, as thejeff says.

But when a province changes hands, earlier in the turn sequence, that raies unrest in the province from zero (by around 5 to 15), even if there is no battle. The unrest increase occurs before income is generated for the province, since that's right at the end of the turn sequence. So income is lower than expected.

I think that ignoring scale effects, income for a freshly-takes province is calculated at 100% no matter what the previous occupant taxed that province at, as Micah says. The income for the province in the turn the province is taken is also affected by the unrest. Then the auto-taxation rules are applied and taxes are lowered to reduce the unrest in the upcoming end-of-turn.

@Psycho: it's option 'C' in your explanation, if you include lower income due to unrest.

Edit: Ninjad by Chris!

[Psycho]

The option c) includes the changed scales effect and unrest decrease. The income with nation B's scales would be a), the same amount as nation B. Unrest is not the explanation either.

[Psycho]

OK, here is a concrete example:

Nation A takes a province from B. Nation B has 181 gold income from the province. Next turn there are no changed scales (Order3 Sloth3 Growth2 Misf2, Magic1) and 23 unrest in the province.

Nation A earned 102 gold from the province.

Taxes were set automatically to 50% and income with 23 unrest and 50% taxes is shown as 47.

When I set taxes to 100% and with 23 unrest income is 97.

I put taxes to 0 to reduce unrest, click end turn. Scales remain the same. With 100% taxes and 0 unrest income is 140 gold.

I can find no combination that would give me the received 102 gold from the province.