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[TwoBits]

Originally Posted by Hoplosternum

Well I am not sure that by attacking none Monkey provinces you are encouraging anyone to take down the Nexus for you. After all most of us only risk to lose to someone other than yourself or Dr P While you and Abysia can see that possible win get sucked out of your nations and into Kailasa's Nexus

Why haven't you and Aby taken it down? You have much more to lose than the rest of us if it stays up for long. You and Aby get over 230 gems a turn between you. Even if you don't get a single natural pearl between you that's 115/turn after alchemy. Cast your own dispel....

First off, I have raided and taken Monkey provinces - but mostly I'm hunkering down on defense, because I expected I would be attacked from all sides!

I'll give kudos to Kailasa's diplomacy, and grumble about everyone else'. No one, NO ONE, offered to help cast a dispel. More importantly, no one, NO ONE, contradicted my assumption that they weren't all in on it with Kailasa!

No one other than Verjigorm expressed serious concern about the Nexus. In fact, the insinuation from Kailasa was that other powers (and I assumed that meant TNN, Abysia, and Helheim) had accepted a hefty share of gems to ally with him (and Yomi confirmed that he was also negotiating for a share as well).

Since no one bothered to counter that assumption, I had to assume that everyone was against me, and thus make my own play, which was to forget casting Dispel (what's the point when the Nexus would go right back up with everyone's connivance?), and go for the VPs. It wasn't a good plan, but it seemed to be all I had.

Well, was my analysis wrong? Are folks not on board with Kailasa? If so, damn, let me know! Like I said, I can still make a deal But if I don't hear anything serious, I'm gonna keep figuring it's Marverni against everyone else

[Verjigorm]

Originally Posted by TwoBits

I'm gonna keep figuring it's Marverni against everyone else

Welcome to the club. ^_^

Hold all 5 VPs for 20 turns.

Go!

[Eximius Sus]

I must say. Maerlande must be enjoying the chaos he has caused. Perhaps that was his only goal?

[TwoBits]

Originally Posted by Verjigorm

Welcome to the club. ^_^

LOL! Yes, there is a certain amount of irony

[Hoplosternum]

Firstly let me apologise about abusing my Admin powers by granting myself an extra day for the turn. I was away from home last night and hadn't completed my turn. I have added a further 6 hours from a request.

We may have a problem with Dr P. He staled last turn and has not put in a turn this time yet either. Anyone heard from him?

If he has gone then we will need to find a replacement. But he may just be away for a few day. Either way I hope no one takes this as an opportunity to attack him. It's extremely cheesy play I don't include Stagger/Ermor in this as obviously he should be free to liberate his lands. But Abysia is a viable power and I would hate to see the game skewed by people taking advantage of a major power taking a week or two off. Can we all agree (except for Ermor) to keep out of Abysia's lands until they are clearly being led again?

[Hoplosternum]

I will just put this out there. But I am NOT advocating it. Just putting this up as a suggestion.

Shall we call this one a draw?

If Dr P has gone only myself, TwoBits and Verji remain of the original players. I joined because I liked the idea of bidding and I liked the idea of having victory conditions which meant (I hoped!) we would not have to fight it out till the bitter end.

But many/most of the players have changed. And the bidding for powers - while a good idea - did not really work as there were few bids against one another. And besides that was ages ago And many of the players in the game did not even take part in it!

The Victory spaces have proved to be a waste of time. Unless you are strong enough to win anyway you are highly unlikely to win by VPs. Plus they are an admin nightmare

So while the game is nicely poised we are all facing a potentially long end game. Maverni, Kali (if he keeps his Nexus for a while) and Abysia all have great chances to win. TNN and Yomi both have a decent outside chance and even I am not completely out of it. That's a lot of end game. If big wars are about to start that's long long turns for us all.

So while I am happy to carry on I will just put that out there for you all to think on. I don't think Maverni (or anyone else) could really claim they are far enough ahead to claim victory. And the game has let too many powers get in to the end game so this one is likely to run for a long while yet. Especially as I suspect we have all done enough research even if we haven't completed everything we could (so all mages are 'available' if needed).

[TwoBits]

Originally Posted by Hoplosternum

I will just put this out there. But I am NOT advocating it. Just putting this up as a suggestion.

Shall we call this one a draw?

If Dr P has gone only myself, TwoBits and Verji remain of the original players. I joined because I liked the idea of bidding and I liked the idea of having victory conditions which meant (I hoped!) we would not have to fight it out till the bitter end.

But many/most of the players have changed. And the bidding for powers - while a good idea - did not really work as there were few bids against one another. And besides that was ages ago And many of the players in the game did not even take part in it!

The Victory spaces have proved to be a waste of time. Unless you are strong enough to win anyway you are highly unlikely to win by VPs. Plus they are an admin nightmare

So while the game is nicely poised we are all facing a potentially long end game. Maverni, Kali (if he keeps his Nexus for a while) and Abysia all have great chances to win. TNN and Yomi both have a decent outside chance and even I am not completely out of it. That's a lot of end game. If big wars are about to start that's long long turns for us all.

So while I am happy to carry on I will just put that out there for you all to think on. I don't think Maverni (or anyone else) could really claim they are far enough ahead to claim victory. And the game has let too many powers get in to the end game so this one is likely to run for a long while yet. Especially as I suspect we have all done enough research even if we haven't completed everything we could (so all mages are 'available' if needed).

You know, I've only been in a few games that have reached this late game stage, but they all seem to have had the same late game "malaise": Half (or more) of the players are subs (despite pledges, etc.), and the remaining original players are kind of burnt out (and probably enjoying other, newer, perhaps more interesting games).

But that's no reason to pack it in, IMO. For starters, the introduction of Maerlande and the Arcane Nexus has certainly made things more entertaining at the moment! And some of us original players still like our chances at victory.

The original bid plan may not seem relevant now, but it did mean no Mictlan, and Hinnom, Niefelheim, etc., are no more. And as far as the VP thing goes, it is a bit of an admin pain, but it does open an alternate route to sure victory (one Arco tried, and one which I've nearly felt compelled into trying).

If the micro-hassle is getting to be a bit much (but be thankful there are no gem generators or uber blood nations anymore), perhaps we should just extend the Llamaserver clock, and just take it easy? No rush, no pressure, just relax and do your turns whenever.

The missing DrP situation is kind of worrying. It would be sad if he went AWOL, and we lost another original player. But we've found subs before, and I'm sure we can again.

If worse comes to worse, you can just declare me the victor, and leave it at that

[Debaser8]

I think having the victory points all in one place is a mistake. If they were scattered and automatically tallied a few players would be building towards victory, which would force the action.

I am beginning to feel like an original player . I am ready to call it in, if there is no DrP. Isn't he on IRC a lot?

[Eximius Sus]

I suggest you don't worry about DrP. Maerlande talks to him most days on IRC. He's still in the game although he does express the opinion that he'd like it to move towards an end. And that is related to the Nexus. It was partially a way to push the game out of stalemate.

You might just want to revisit the VP conditions. Maybe just changing them right now to say 4 capitals might force a quick end. Or maybe 5 capitals. I think this victory system is broken. Not forting a VP is crazy.

[TwoBits]

Originally Posted by Eximius Sus

I suggest you don't worry about DrP. Maerlande talks to him most days on IRC. He's still in the game although he does express the opinion that he'd like it to move towards an end. And that is related to the Nexus. It was partially a way to push the game out of stalemate.

You might just want to revisit the VP conditions. Maybe just changing them right now to say 4 capitals might force a quick end. Or maybe 5 capitals. I think this victory system is broken. Not forting a VP is crazy.

Ah, I've suspected Abysia and Kailasa might be in cahoots A few turns ago (right after Maerlande took over), Abysia attacked Kailasa and was rebuffed in an epic battle, and since then, they seem to have made nice-nice.

An Abysia/Kailasa axis with the Nexus would be hard to overcome. Just such a possibility (plus I thought everyone else was in on it too) was what pushed me to go the (admittedly awkward) VP land grab route.

I'd be willing to discuss alternate victory conditions. Just as long as they don't blatantly favor any one particular nation (say, a nation with massive access to Astral Pearls, for example).

Remember, I've always got the original VP plan to fall back on - try to hold the VPs I already have for another 18-19 turns or so. Think that's a joke? You just might be surprised. I might just be able to outlast (figuratively or literally) you all, if your hearts are not in it.

But I'd prefer an alternative.