New Strategy: Drones with Subverters !

[Krsqk]

Not to rehash the entire of AS/Talisman/Uberweapon (like it's not going on anyway):
1) Build hundreds or thousands of smaller ships. The AS can only capture so many per combat. Swarm them to death.
2) Researching Talisman or AS costs a good deal of extra research. Getting both costs a horrendous amount of extra research. Your economy is unlikely to be able to support all those extra ships you're going to be stealing. If you're just going to scrap them, then why not blow them up in the first place? It's more efficient in a 25-30 turn combat.
3) As stated before, it takes a while to catch up to ships/fleets set at max range. An opponent with good strategies can pick you to death.
4) Use fighters. Sure, they can be slaughtered by PDC, but AS and Talisman already take up a lot of space. PDC just takes more away from your real weapons--and I'm sure you remembered to pack those as well, right?
5) Use swarms of small boarding party ships. They don't cost much, they build quickly, and it doesn't matter if you a few get subverted--you can kill them pretty quickly anyway. If the AS ship doesn't have a self-destruct, you get all that pretty weaponry. The AS chain-reaction effect is pretty well documented. If it does have a self-destruct, then it's mission accomplished anyway.

It makes no sense, BTW, to allow shields to block psychic crew conVersion. It's supposed to be something extra-material. I don't remember the descriptions for the other psychic weapons off-hand, but it may make some sense to allow those to be blocked by shields/armor.

In summary, of course AS + Talisman hurts your opponent--it's supposed to. After all, you're spending 3000 RP on it. They can spend 3000 RP on a whole lot of other things--propulsion experts, better SY rate, better maintenance reduction, better economy, better aggressiveness, etc... There is no perfect counter to any option (well, except for building nothing but colony ships and sensor sats); but there are ways to defeat any combo. It should be expensive to defeat the AS+Talisman combo, given its cost in RP.

[Fyron]

Subverters are not all or nothing, esp. without mounts. If the damage is lower than 100, then there is a chance they fail (as the chance to convert equals the damage).

[Krsqk]

While on the "it makes no sense" wagon, how exactly does one go about using psychic weapons from unmanned units like sats or drones? Do they "borrow" someone's brain and put it onboard? This is just plain weird.

[Fyron]

The mind is nothing more than a sophisticated system of electrical impulses. It could be replicated on a drone or something with enough study and time.

[Baron Munchausen]

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
Subverters are not all or nothing, esp. without mounts. If the damage is lower than 100, then there is a chance they fail (as the chance to convert equals the damage).

Either your ship is converted to the enemy, or it has no effect. They work or they don't. That's the definition of 'all or nothing'. If the crew could be subverted in increments you could have a much more interesting situation.

[Cheeze]

Krsk, you made an excellent post. I would add two other options to combat these weapons.

1)Use engine destroyers - If you eliminate the Talisman/Subverter ship's ability to move, you may prevent it from closing to a distance where it can use this weapon. Now it can be eliminated by longer-ranged weapons without worry.

2)Use repulser beams - As with the above strategy, this might allow your ships to move in, strike and then push the Talisman/Subverter ship far beyond a range to move in and attack.

The combination of 1 and 2 would appear to work well.

I might have added Weapon Overloading weapons, but I have never really seen them used, and they do not seem worthwhile, given their poor range, limited damage and slow firing rate. Perhaps on starbases, satellites or weapons platforms (in Gold) this might be different.

[Despotic Fiend]

Originally posted by Cheeze:
Krsk, you made an excellent post. I would add two other options to combat these weapons.

1)Use engine destroyers - If you eliminate the Talisman/Subverter ship's ability to move, you may prevent it from closing to a distance where it can use this weapon. Now it can be eliminated by longer-ranged weapons without worry.

2)Use repulser beams - As with the above strategy, this might allow your ships to move in, strike and then push the Talisman/Subverter ship far beyond a range to move in and attack.

The combination of 1 and 2 would appear to work well.

I might have added Weapon Overloading weapons, but I have never really seen them used, and they do not seem worthwhile, given their poor range, limited damage and slow firing rate. Perhaps on starbases, satellites or weapons platforms (in Gold) this might be different.

I would say to use Massive Engine Destroyer(if you can get it) because this would work excellently, if you wipe his engines and he manages to grab the ship it won't reload during combat and you can destroy it before combat ends and then wipe his talisman/subverter ship as well.