TG contest and system facilities bug ?

Tomgs · #1 February 16th, 2001, 10:37 PM

Well it says right on the Time shrine and the SRF that there can be only one with this effect per system. Since the effects are the same they should not stack. The only advantage the time shrines have is that they are a lot lower on a tech tree so you can get them long before you get the SRF's. I usually build Time Shrines first then scrap them when I have built the SRF's.

The planet facilities and the system facilities are designed to stack so that is no problem. the only things that shouldn't stack are two planet facilities on the same planet (this works now) or two system facilities in the same system (this is bugged). As long as the bugged part isn't done the contest should be fine. And as you say its real easy to catch.

Kimball The system and planet facilities do stack but its hard to see the effects since the system facility additions aren't shown on any one planet. A system facility adds to the total amount in the system and that effect shows up in the total in the Empire, Intell, or Research screen but doesn't show any increase on any specific planet so it looks like there is no effect unless you know what the total should be and add in the system facilities effects.

[This message has been edited by Tomgs (edited 16 February 2001).]

geoschmo · #2 February 16th, 2001, 11:14 PM

I don't think it'll be a problem as long as it is easy to catch as you say.

Shouldn't the system robo facil and the various racial system-wide bonus facilities be allowed to stack? They have the same result, but they achive that result by different means. Are we sure that is a bug or is it how it was intended to operate.

Now if you could have two system robo fac's or two time shrines in the same system and have them both work, I would agree that was a bug.

But if I build a System Robo Facility which produces robotic workers for my mines, I should get a bonus. If my race also has the Religous tech ability and I build a time shrine, why shouldn't that also give me a bonus. Unless you think the robo facility means I am replacing all of my non-robotic workers. I don't see it that way though.

In the future I would like to see MM have the planet production numbers reflect the presence of system-wide facilities. It should show up as well in the abbilities display for each planet like population and racial bonuses do now.

geoschmo · #3 February 16th, 2001, 11:21 PM

quote:
Well it says right on the Time shrine and the SRF that there can be only one with this effect per system.

Actually it doesn't.

What it says is,

quote:
Ability 1 Descr := Increases the value of all planets in the system by 1% each year (only 1 facility per system effective).

Now you could interperet this as one of each facility with this effect, or one of each facility of this type. I prefer the second definition. I think it is more logical.

raynor · #4 February 17th, 2001, 01:23 AM

quote:
Originally posted by geoschmo:
Now you could interperet this as one of each facility with this effect, or one of each facility of this type. I prefer the second definition. I think it is more logical.

I agree that it is more logical. I had planned to build both types of facilities in my game. But... if you have an SRF in a system, doesn't it give you a warning message when you try to build a TS? The message says: You already have a facility of this type in this system.

To me, that means the developer never intended for you to benefit from multiple SRF's in a system *OR* an SRF and a TS in the same system.

[This message has been edited by raynor (edited 16 February 2001).]

Drake · #5 February 17th, 2001, 01:32 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Nyx:
I know Drake used Time and robot stacking, but I don't really have a problem with that.

Actually, I didn't use it. I don't have any time shrines in my game. *shrug* That would've put me at 313M.

The game in most instances doesn't allow facilities of the same TYPE to stack. You aren't supposed to get the benefit from both.

An example of this is the medical lab and gestation vats. If I have gestation vats on a planet, and try to build a medical lab in the same system, I get the warning, "You already have a facility in the system with similiar [sic] system-wide abilities." If you build both, you'll only get the bonus from the best one (gestation vats).

For the specific instance of Time Shrines and System Robotoid Facilities, the game will also warn you about the redundancy of the facility you are building. This clearly indicates to me that they aren't supposed to work together even though they currently are. Otherwise there would be no reason to warn me when I'm adding it to my build queue.

From the wording on the warning, I thought it was clear that only one TYPE of system-wide ability facilities would be allowed per system, and that the issue with time shrines was a bug, and thus should not be allowed.

If you do allow them, it just means that ppl will be forced to take religious. Those that didn't are pretty much screwed....(you did mention we could resubmit a game saved from a previous point, right? I need to redo my Last 5 turns if this isn't disallowed, heh.

)

-Drake
(clarity edit)

[This message has been edited by Drake (edited 17 February 2001).]

geoschmo · #6 February 17th, 2001, 02:22 AM

I had never actually tried using both in a game situation. I was simply going by their descriptions in the Facility.txt file.

Given that the game is giving an additional warning at the time of construction then I will have to concede that it is clearly not the intention of Aaron (regardless of my opinion on whether or not it should work that way) to allow different types with the same ability, and as such it is a bug.

As it is a potentially serious bug as Drake demonstrates I would have to agree that it should not be allowed in the contest.

geoschmo · #7 February 17th, 2001, 02:32 AM

I went and tested it and see what you guys mean now. The intention is unmistakeable from the message you get when trying to build the second facility.

Also Alyasr and TOMGS were correct. You can build one of each on the same planet and the game only gives you benefit from one.

But if you build them on separate planets, you get the benefit from both. Clearly something screwy going on here that will be addressed in a later patch I am sure.

As Drake says unless we want everyone using the religious tech, you better disallow the practice fo rthe contest.