Important Math Question

[Ran-Taro]

Originally posted by geoschmo:
Hmmmm, I seem to have hit a problem here. My previous post started out as a statement showing why Phoenix-D was right, that an infinite universe would not be infinitly hot.

However, in my post I stated that any particular point in in infinite universe would contain not an infinite number of photons, but very small and finite fraction of the total number of photons in the universe. However, according to those that are supposed to know about this stuff, any fraction of infinity is still infinity. Of course mathematics also tells us that any number divided by itself is 1. Therefore infinity divided by infinity is simultaneously equal to infinity, and 1. (By the way, if noone has thought of that before I am going to name it the Geoschmo paradox. )

So I guess Phoenix-D and Grandpa Kim are both right. Glad we cleared that up.

Infinity is not a number. It is a concept.

Dividing Infinity by Infinity is like dividing an apple by an apple.

[edit] However dividing infinity in half is not like dividing an apple in half. You would get two infinities, not two halves of infinity (because you cannot reduce something that is limitlessly big in size by dividing it, since the half would still, by definition, be limitlessly big).

Imagine trying to halve all the possible idea's in the world - both halves would still be limitlessly big, hence infinite.

My head hurts.

[ November 04, 2003, 20:59: Message edited by: Ran-Taro ]

[Suicide Junkie]

When you have an infinity over infinity, try L'hopital's rule from calculus

[PvK]

An infinite quantity divided by two gives two infinite quantities. Example: the number of points in any volume is infinite. Divide a sphere in two, and you have two hemispheres, and both contain an infinite number of points.

An infinite number of something is not the same as every instance of a thing, in mathematics.

PvK

[EvilGenius4ABetterTomorro]

Sorry but I think the universe is finite. The Last I heard is that the universe is expanding and when it is done expanding, it will contract upon itself because of the pull of dark matter.
Eventually probably leading to another big bang.

The only other theory has the universe expanding until the time when even electrons will decay and matter falls apart and dissapates (heat death) although it's really the lack of heat. This end makes me sad. Boo hoo!

Now I ask you, If/when the universe starts contracting, will time run backwards?
Yeah I really didn't want to get in the middle of the infinite terminology photon debate thingy but really the Last I heard was the universe is finite.
Oh and I saw from space.com that the "average" color of the universe is Biege?
oh well "To infinity and beyond!"

[Atrocities]

The question remains, what was the universe before it became the universe? Its the chicken and the egg question but on a universal scale.

So nothing exsisted before the universe? If that is true, then the universe could not have been formed. Zero + any number is still zero. But 1 + any number and you have a new number.

I often wonder if we are the egg before the Chicken, and one day our egg will hatch into a new world and the cycle of life will begin all over.

[EvilGenius4ABetterTomorro]

Yeah, that's it.
My head hurts. Oweee!

[narf poit chez BOOM]

dark matter pushes. i think.

what's L'hopital's? rule?

Therefore infinity divided by infinity is simultaneously equal to infinity, and 1

1 of: infinity

Imagine trying to halve all the possible idea's in the world - both halves would still be limitlessly big, hence infinite.

My head hurts.

now think about the fact that both infinite halves would be smaller than the whole...

Calculations involving infinity tend to break down into paradoxes.

i think that's because we try to fit infinite into the definitions and calculations we've developed for finity.

1. The infinite number of photons in the universe have to all be in the same place; just where you happen to be standing. Besides being an incredible piece of bad luck, this would be quite difficult to time. And if you managed it somehow, you'd be left with an infinite sized universe empty of photons, except where you are.

nope, would only need a fraction of the photons...

Ignore me.

nope.

Good points, and certainly true for a universe which is expanding at an accelerating rate, as our universe currently seems to be. Of course, in such a universe, the volume that we can interact with in any way is certainly very finite, so you throw away much of the appeal of having an infinite universe.

who says we're the only big bang?

Zero + any number is still zero. But 1 + any number and you have a new number.

i think you mean *.

and now, about my day...this is much of what i remember...truthfully...boxes...and pain...boxes...and pain...boxes...and pain...boxes...and pain...boxes...and pain...boxes...and pain...boxes...and pain...boxes...and pain...boxes...and pain...boxes...and pain...boxes...and pain...boxes...and pain...boxes...and pain...boxes...and pain

[ November 05, 2003, 00:29: Message edited by: narf poit chez BOOM ]