SEV - Intel Suggestions for MM

[bearclaw]

I don't know if this would be too advanced or not (in terms of micromanagment) but what if Intel was removed from the research queue entirely. Instead, you would have an Intel screen, similar to the research screen. On it would be various Intel projects and/or training and/or agents. Intel points would be spent like research points. Various options would only become possible when you're agents were in position.

Each level of each Intel Project would increase your chance of success for instance. Before something like a Ship Bomb could be planted, you would have to use Intel points to get an agent in position on an enemy planet. The more agents on enemy planets, the higher the chance of success as you would have agents more likely to encounter the target ship.

Something like Crew Insurrection would require X agents in ship N crew manafest before you could even attempt it. PPP would require X(planet size) agents and perhaps some other planet specific projects to succeed before being attempted.

Don't know if I explained this very well. I hope I did because I think this would over come a lot of the comments about Cre Insurrections and PPP's being too easy. It would become a process instead. It would also seperate Intel from Research. So better Intel facilites or Training facilites would be a factor of Intel points rather than Research points. As would skill in certain Intel Projects. You could have an empire who's focus has been on Ship Bombs to the point that they are experts at it but suck at gathering Intel. It would also add another dimention to what empires could interact for. The Ship Bomb expert could be hired out to bomb for others for instance.

Intel points would have to be generated from the very beginning of the game rather than the way they are now, though, which makes more sense to me. Our planet may not have many Intel Facilities but I'm sure there are some that would qualify.

Wow. That turned out longer than I planned

[Stone Mill]

Suicide Junkie and Parasite,

Thank you. I rolled your suggestions into my original post.

Bearclaw,
Your idea sounds quite interesting. However, it sounds like it's the beginning of an entirely new and complex model... perhaps I'll add it as an addendum as an idea for a different model?

By all means if anyone has any ideas on improving the model I propose... or proposing any models of their own, please do. Or if their are any great ideas I missed from a previous thread...

[Baron Munchausen]

Interesting proposal, but lacking in one crucial aspect -- politics! There should be influences from the state of 'unrest' on each planet, the species inhabiting the planet (if it's your 'original' race or a conquered species or a species representing another uncounquered empire!), and the dominant species of the empire attempting the intel operation. Essentially, both individual planets and 'species' will have unrest or loyalty Ratings. Not only can a given planet be in an unfavorable 'mood' and make intel operations more likely to succeed, but an entire species of an opposing empire could also be in an unfavorable mood and highly disposed to aid enemy intel operations. Planets inhabited by your original race would tend to be more loyal and so more difficult to carry out intel operations on, of course.

Implementing this properly requires some unrest 'modifiers' based on the relations of your empire to the 'original' empire of the race(s) on your controlled planets, and level of unrest for other reasons, and how you deal with it (fix conditions causing unrest or just land troops?) and a few other such things.

Combine this with some modifications to the way troops affect a planet -- first a slight reduction in the chance of intel sucess per troop, capped at some reasonable level so you can't make completely immune planets by piling on hundreds of troops, and second that troops should remain loyal when a planet rebels and attempt to put down the rebellion (fight the militia essentially), and you've got some really interesting situations possible.

[narf poit chez BOOM]

Simply make troop effectiveness for unrest a curve.

[Q]

I like the idea of intel projects working as direct fire weapons in combat with offensive and defensive (and racial characteristics) modifiers very much and I think this should be not too complicated to realize.
The idea of counter intel as a boost for the defense without 100% safety is very good too IMO. Anything than the current system in SE IV with counter intel projects that just are lost upon completion seems better to me.
I am not sure if you want intel points divided in offensive or defensive with different facilities to produce them? That IMO would be too static. I think you should be able to switch rapidly from offensive to defensive intel.
For the AI a intel project file, that defines which intel projects are used, should be created.

[Cheeze]

I would agree that the "direct fire" approach seems to offer a solution that is playable and easiest to program. I would bring up one obvious additional factor: the Fate Shrine. Would its intel defense function be eliminated, or should it simply reduce the chance of mission success? On that note, since there will be ways for races to defend themselves, would the Fate Shrine be able to improve on that defense (as Nature Shrines can work in conjunction with Value Improvement plants) or would it operate in an "whichever is greater" method (Time Shrines and System Robotoid Factories)?

[Atrocities]

Do any of you recall a game where intel worked well? Perhaps if we had an example of how intel can work and work well then maybe Aaron might be able to use those concepts in SE V if applicable.

I liked how intel kinda worked in Rebellion in that you had agents with varing skills. The card editor allowed you to edit the effectiveness of the operative. Some operatives were better at specific things than others, and there were teams you could buy that would go out and conduct sabotage.

If SE V had both intel and counter intel operations, and you had to train specialized personal for specific mission, and they were re-usuable if successful, then perhaps intel could take a gaint leap forward. Just my .o2 cents.