Dom I Strategies which WON'T work in Dom II

Nagot Gick Fel · #1 October 17th, 2003, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pocus:

quote:
Originally posted by Nagot Gick Fel:

quote:
Originally posted by Pocus:
lifelong protection is one of the item which must be nerfed, IMHO.

Simple nerf: just increase the probability for Horror attack.
instead of an endless stream of imps, which enable an assassin to take out all but the nastiest commanders, I would have prefered something like 5 rounds of imps and then no more. Sufficient IMHO compared to the power of the item.

Or 1 imp/round instead of 2 (my preference). Or a swarm of 10-20 imps when the battle starts (similar to the Wraith Crown).

Aristoteles · #2 October 18th, 2003, 01:53 AM

Lifelong protection must be nerfed, OR

as we all know, the disabling spell ability in the mod tools is a must have. If we will be able to disable spells, these discussions will be pointless. We can disable the unbalanced/disliked spells by our own, and we wont have to whine, that 'plz fix this, fix that'. IW is already flooded with work.

Pocus · #3 October 17th, 2003, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Aristoteles:
Lifelong protection must be nerfed, OR

as we all know, the disabling spell ability in the mod tools is a must have. If we will be able to disable spells, these discussions will be pointless. We can disable the unbalanced/disliked spells by our own, and we wont have to whine, that 'plz fix this, fix that'. IW is already flooded with work.

i feel that we are reashing again and again the same things :

1. it is always better to have a game balanced by the devs, they know all the intricacies and implications incurred by a changes, it is their game after all.
2. it solves the problem of players which dont have time to browse all the mods to asserts which ones balances things the way they want. Also, not all players are aware enough of the game subttle mechanisms to make the best appraisal about a given issue.
3. it solves the problem of MP games where you have to decide democratically which one to use.

ywl · #4 October 17th, 2003, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Nerfix:

quote:
Originally posted by ywl:
"Curse of the Deads", a spell to curse a commander with a large body-count remotely.

"Mark of Kurgi", a spell to horror-mark a mass murderer from a distance - for later Horror attack.

"Smite of Justice", a thunderbolt to strike whoever kill too many.

"Scythe of Conscience", renders whoever kill too many feeblemind ?

Just some random thoughts.

I kinda like them, but they are commander bLasting spells, and "Assasination" was one of the ten whammies... Curse of Death and Mark of Kurgi are good, but Smite of Justice and Scythe of Conscience are commander bLasting spells for sure.

They're for targeting mass murderers.

Magic save can always be allowed. I was just being light in detail.

ywl · #5 October 17th, 2003, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pocus:
The murdering winter spell, aside from taking out group of mages along with mundane units (thus weakening them even further compared to magical summons) act as a very strong deterrent to gather any sizable force in a given location. A nation which is capable of MW'ing his opponent has already strategical and tactical superiority, even before casting the second one, as your opponent will have big difficulties (to say the least) resisting any sizable land attacks of your. When the MW'ing nation has national units immune to cold, as Caelum, it is even worse, as you cant force him to break down his force into defeatable stacks.

>- snipped -<

To understand the problem, you have to play games which Last reasonnably long, on medium to large maps. It seems to me that dominions is failing in his game balance when you reach this point, but this is seldomly seen as most tests and games are stopped before reaching this extremity.

If Daynarr or Psitticine can give their opinion on how these spells play in doms II, then perhaps further conclusions could be drawn.[/QB]

If cold resistance is now only partial, it might give Caelum a smaller advantage. I agree that cold-resistant or underwater nations have a major advantage here.

On the game of game balance in the late game. It could be the key of the issue. Or it's just because magical endgames in MP have different rules or foci from what everybody is used to. Such endgames so uncommonly played, and the player base of Dom 1 is so small that I don't think we've explored them well-enough.

apoger · #6 October 17th, 2003, 04:31 PM

>I don't think that you can kill 600 troops with a single MW. As Alex said, it can only kill 20%-40% of an army. If your enemy has a 2000 units army, Mw won't help you.

A single MW or FFTS will kill very close to 20-25% of an army that is made of conventional troops. With multiple castings you can get the damage close to 50%, and yes I have seen/done multiples many times.

As Pocus points out, one of the big effects is strategic. Once an enemy gets hit by MW/FFTS he tends to split his forces up to mitigate the potential damage. Now the attacker can focus while the enemy is split up.

I usually don't cast these spells to nail troops. I am almost always more interested in depleting the mage strength in the army. Many opponents use communion, relief, or wards. If I can knock out any part of a combo pre-battle it's worth almost any gem cost!

On the other hand... we are discussing Dom I, who can say what will happen in Dom II after players have worked the new system for months?

Mortifer · #7 October 17th, 2003, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pocus:

quote:
Originally posted by Aristoteles:
Lifelong protection must be nerfed, OR

as we all know, the disabling spell ability in the mod tools is a must have. If we will be able to disable spells, these discussions will be pointless. We can disable the unbalanced/disliked spells by our own, and we wont have to whine, that 'plz fix this, fix that'. IW is already flooded with work.

i feel that we are reashing again and again the same things :

1. it is always better to have a game balanced by the devs, they know all the intricacies and implications incurred by a changes, it is their game after all.
2. it solves the problem of players which dont have time to browse all the mods to asserts which ones balances things the way they want. Also, not all players are aware enough of the game subttle mechanisms to make the best appraisal about a given issue.
3. it solves the problem of MP games where you have to decide democratically which one to use.

I agree Pocus. The vanilla game must be balanced.
However I agree with Aristoteles as well. If you feel that something is unbalanced you can remove it. That is always good.
Just check out the various balance packs for SE IV. It is a good things, if the players are able to balance/tweak what they want.