Dominion effects

[Wick]

"It is appr 23% after 30 turns. And you get the 6% flat income increase, and the supply bonus, and are not eligeble for certain bad luck events. Growth scales were by many considered one of the no brainers in dom 1, now its effectiveness is reduced by giving it 3% less of an income increase per step, I still think it is a useful scale.

Population growth in excess of 9% a year seems absurd to me."

Inspired by the Astral Clam and Fever Fetish, I generally try to normalize investment calculations over 10 turns. During that time, IICC, the pop bonus averages 1% per level, add the direct +2% and that's +3% gold/lvl/turn. With Order giving +7%, your troops need to be real hungry to make up the difference. As for 9% being excessive, no argument. The cost/lvl could be adjusted downward instead or something. Are the starting gold and population numbers untouchable?

You did raise another interesting point though: which scales influence particular events? Magic I know does (and I'm pretty sure effects Crossbreeding too), and you've just said Growth. Is Productivity/Sloth or Heat/Cold required for any events? I imagine that Order & Luck only effect the chance?

[johan osterman]

Originally posted by Wick:

You did raise another interesting point though: which scales influence particular events? Magic I know does (and I'm pretty sure effects Crossbreeding too), and you've just said Growth. Is Productivity/Sloth or Heat/Cold required for any events? I imagine that Order & Luck only effect the chance?

All the scales influences the events in some way. For example you need a death scale to get death gems or the plague. I do not remember for certain but you probably need at least growth 0 for exceptional harvest etc. I do not remember most of them but there are many events that requires a specified scale or some other circumstance. There are even more of these types of events in dom 2 where there are events that only take place if a certain unit is present in the province or if the terrain is of a specified terrain etc.

[ October 18, 2003, 11:19: Message edited by: johan osterman ]

[apoger]

You have to keep in mind that +growth will only get maximum influence at the capital and your core nation area. Out at the borders and inside post-enemy territory the effect won't get you as much, unless the ex-enemy also had +growth.

In comparison +order will pump taxes as soon as your dominion pushes the scales up.

With the weakening of growths tax influence, the scale has lost a huge amount of it's potency.

I suspect we will see many players taking +0, and possibly even -3.

My gut feeling is that both growth and production scales have been diminished to the point that they aren't very important. I hope I'm wrong, and that it turns out to be better balanced than I'm guessing.

[johan osterman]

Originally posted by apoger:

I suspect we will see many players taking +0, and possibly even -3.

This is not a problem, hopefully the changes in growth and production will make it viable to not have growth and production +3.

[Pocus]

Originally posted by johan osterman:

quote:

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Originally posted by Pocus:

quote:

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Originally posted by johan osterman:
(...) and growth by 0.2% per scale step. There is another thread on this somewhere.

you dont like the whole idea of population growing right? I wonder why. Having to invest 120 design points to get a +18% increase in the population of a province, after 30 turns, is not that interesting.

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It is appr 23% after 30 turns. And you get the 6% flat income increase, and the supply bonus, and are not eligeble for certain bad luck events. Growth scales were by many considered one of the no brainers in dom 1, now its effectiveness is reduced by giving it 3% less of an income increase per step, I still think it is a useful scale.

Population growth in excess of 9% a year seems absurd to me.

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dunno, for me 30 turns @ 1.006 give 19% , perhaps there is a base 0.1% at growth 0 (thus giving 22%) ?

higher pop growth would be absurd, but you need to balance scale cost with advantages given. oh well, minor point anyway, there is no that many way to increase economy. I just regret that you had to give growth a blend of pop increase and econ increase, and not only pop increase, just because you felt a too high growth rate would not be realistic.

[Saber Cherry]

Originally posted by Pocus:
higher pop growth would be absurd, but you need to balance scale cost with advantages given. oh well, minor point anyway, there is no that many way to increase economy. I just regret that you had to give growth a blend of pop increase and econ increase, and not only pop increase, just because you felt a too high growth rate would not be realistic.

Higher growth rate is NOT absurd. This is a land of magic, remember? Not to mention that high-growth provinces are lush, beautiful, attractive places to live, and should draw immigrants (pop increase is never defined as "through births only"). Lastly... who says months are 30 days long (or days 24 hours)? That's an Earth thing. If months represent more time, population growth per month could be arbitrarily high, yet still realistic.

[johan osterman]

Originally posted by Saber Cherry:

Higher growth rate is NOT absurd. This is a land of magic, remember? Not to mention that high-growth provinces are lush, beautiful, attractive places to live, and should draw immigrants (pop increase is never defined as "through births only"). Lastly... who says months are 30 days long (or days 24 hours)? That's an Earth thing. If months represent more time, population growth per month could be arbitrarily high, yet still realistic.

9% Growth a year is very high even for a magical world, the population in a province more than quadrouples every generation. Besdides, I like that population is by and large a diminishing resource, it makes the game more apocalyptic.