Concerns about lack of Tutorial and Price of Game

gregebowman · #1 October 31st, 2003, 07:40 PM

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Originally posted by Saber Cherry:

quote:
Originally posted by gregebowman:
Normally, I'll pay no more than $40 for a game. Just depends on the game. With that said, I sent in my check today for the game, because the description sounds like it will be a killer game (I just wish I had played Dom I, or at least seen it in action. I'm buying this game on faith, but Shrapnel Games hasn't disappointed me in any of the purchases I've made so far). I don't really care about the graphics as much as gameplay. Space Empires 4 Gold is a very good example of gameplay over graphics. But I also play Galactic Civilzations. So I'm anxiously waiting to play th is game.

There's no reason to buy on faith when a demo is out, and people are playing demo PBEM games=) And the original Dominions demo is out, at www.illwinter.com, and is (in most ways) more complete than the DomII demo. I sincerely doubt that you'll regret your decision, I just wanted to point out the faith is not necessary=)

I realize that, but it's taking me too dang long to d/l the demo on dial up. Instead of taking a few days waiting for the demo (I only get a few of hours a night of computer time, so I have to balance my time between playing games or going on the internet), I'll just go ahead and buy the game. Like I said earlier, I haven't been disappointed yet in any of the Shrapnel Games products.

Richard · #2 October 31st, 2003, 11:28 PM

Yeah that's about right. Seriously I can't think of the Last time I have seen a full color manual from any publisher. The main page might be color, but the insides are almost always black and white. Unless it's a leaflet manual.

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Originally posted by Alneyan:

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Originally posted by Tim Brooks:
Hi All:
The manual for Dominions II is our largest to date, weighing in at 146 pages. It is however, not in color as someone else posted. Wish we could have done it in color, but for a manual this size, the price of printing in color would have been over $30.00 per unit. Still, the manual is huge and includes a reference of all magic items and spells.

$30.00 for a single manual in color? I have been quite surprised by this figure. I do trust you, but such a price seems... well, *very* expensive. Manuals that expensive are indeed a problem. I don't mind a black and white manual myself, as long as it is complete.

I agree hearthly with the points you raised in your post. (Especially when it comes to the emphasis upon gameplay rather than shiny new graphics)

Fyron · #3 November 1st, 2003, 03:19 AM

You could print a special edition of the manual in color and sell it separately, for the big fans. I'd suggest selling it with a copy of the game, but most of the biggest fans probably pre-ordered a long time ago, so they'd have to pay for the game again.

Could always do both though. I don't know what your minimum orders have to be for numbers of manuals, so it might not be worth it if only a few dozen (or less) people want to buy a color manual...

Tim Brooks · #4 November 2nd, 2003, 12:53 PM

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THIS is SO TRUE !! So many big companies have their developers wasting time on the most elite graphic designs... thus game content and additional features suffer.

There is a reason for this. All things being equal, the newest technology is going to sell over gameplay at retail. The major publishers can't afford not to go cutting edge, and they can't afford to do both- a game that costs several million dollars to produce won't make money. So graphics wins out over gameplay, because it sells better in traditional retail.

Just look at any development team from a major publisher, there are 4 to 6 times as many artists as there are programmers and designers.

The unfortunate consequence of this is that truly great games are overlooked, because they are not cutting edge in the graphics department - the money didin't go into a team of artists but into design and gameplay.

Now every once in a while you get both, but this is usually in a new title, where the developer already had the gameplay and design in place and the publisher didn't have to foot this bill - they concentrated their assets on the graphics. Rarley do you find sequels, that have both graphics and gameplay going for them, because the development effort was now funded with the emphasis on graphics.

Richard · #5 November 3rd, 2003, 02:13 AM

For the costs involved I doubt enough people would be interested for us to make any money on that. A full color manual is ridicously expensive.

Quote:

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
You could print a special edition of the manual in color and sell it separately, for the big fans. I'd suggest selling it with a copy of the game, but most of the biggest fans probably pre-ordered a long time ago, so they'd have to pay for the game again. Could always do both though. I don't know what your minimum orders have to be for numbers of manuals, so it might not be worth it if only a few dozen (or less) people want to buy a color manual...

Watchdog · #6 November 3rd, 2003, 07:27 AM

If the manual costs that much.......then scrap it. Seriously, Give me a nice PDF (I hate adobe but whatever) and save me some cash.

If company's stop paying for them, the price would go down considerably in a few months. But that's neither here nor there.

I always lose my manuals anyway.

[ November 03, 2003, 05:28: Message edited by: Watchdog ]

Richard · #7 November 3rd, 2003, 07:34 AM

No we have to have a printed manual, it is the number 1 way to stop pirates. Normal manuals are fine as far as costs go.

Quote:

Originally posted by Watchdog:
If the manual costs that much.......then scrap it. Seriously, Give me a nice PDF (I hate adobe but whatever) and save me some cash.

If company's stop paying for them, the price would go down considerably in a few months. But that's neither here nor there.

I always lose my manuals anyway.