Astral Magic worthless??

[Saber Cherry]

Astral is excellent, and not a risk at all, in my opinion, unless you have low astral on your pretender. Don't do that.

But national mages with astral aren't the negative many people claim. They can only be mind dueled and killed regularly by enemy astral mages with much higher astral. Those enemy mages are very expensive and still risk death... not a risk I'd want to take. Witch hunters are often mentioned as vulnerable... but who would risk an expensive astral-3 mage mind-dueling a 150 gold witch hunter?

-Cherry

[apoger]

>but who would risk an expensive astral-3 mage mind-dueling a 150 gold witch hunter?

Nobody... but you have to reverse that situation. If I have a bunch of Witch Hunters and I come up against a player fielding some very expensive/dangerous astral-3 mages wouldn't it be in my best interest to gamble on some duels?


Magic Duel is not an issue that you deal with all the time. It's more of an "Achilles’ heel" that gets exploited rarely, but when it happens it can be devastating.


When I play a nation that has astral-3 mages you can bet that as the game goes long, I am preparing a Magic Duel specialist. Eventually I get an astral-4 mage when a random skill comes in astral. Add on a Starshine Skullcap, Crystal Shield, Crystal Coin, Ring of Sorcery, and a level of empowerment... and I have an Astral-9 mage. Even if I face no astral opponents this is a potent mage. If I encounter an enemy army with a bunch of astral 2-3 mages... you can bet I'll be looking to engage with my astral-9. Teleport right to the front, and let the dueling begin! Of course this is not a common event, but I'm telling you straight up that games turn on such events when they happen.


Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that players should avoid using astral magic. What I'm saying is that Magic Duel is a consideration when doing so.

[ioticus]

apoger said:
>but who would risk an expensive astral-3 mage mind-dueling a 150 gold witch hunter?

Nobody... but you have to reverse that situation. If I have a bunch of Witch Hunters and I come up against a player fielding some very expensive/dangerous astral-3 mages wouldn't it be in my best interest to gamble on some duels?


Magic Duel is not an issue that you deal with all the time. It's more of an "Achilles’ heel" that gets exploited rarely, but when it happens it can be devastating.


When I play a nation that has astral-3 mages you can bet that as the game goes long, I am preparing a Magic Duel specialist. Eventually I get an astral-4 mage when a random skill comes in astral. Add on a Starshine Skullcap, Crystal Shield, Crystal Coin, Ring of Sorcery, and a level of empowerment... and I have an Astral-9 mage. Even if I face no astral opponents this is a potent mage. If I encounter an enemy army with a bunch of astral 2-3 mages... you can bet I'll be looking to engage with my astral-9. Teleport right to the front, and let the dueling begin! Of course this is not a common event, but I'm telling you straight up that games turn on such events when they happen.


Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that players should avoid using astral magic. What I'm saying is that Magic Duel is a consideration when doing so.

Isn't it true that magic items do not count for magic duels? Also, if you empower a mage does it count in a duel, or is only his original power counted?

[Cainehill]

Empowerment should count. Magic items, well - some people have reported possible bugs with a few of the magic items having an effect ( I think the staff that raises all mages astral level, for one ).

[Edi]

Items don't count for magic duels, only native talent does. At least if I correctly remember what the devs said. Empowerment increases native talent, so that's about that. I don't know if MR boosts affect it, in which case a starshine skullcap is desirable in any event.

Edi

[NTJedi]

I'm also quite certain loading a bunch of items for astral bonus will not make any difference for improving a mind duel.

[Endoperez]

Also, as a historical note, at one time Mind Duel was greatly feared because it seemed that with even slightly higher Astral level, the attacking mage would never lose. Then it was found out that it was a bug, and that the offender (the mage casting Mind Duel) always won! Of course, Mind Duel has since been corrected, but it isn't as frightening as it used to be. There is risk in it, now.

As I understand it, Witch Hunters aren't in danger from Arch Theurgs and other powerful but expensive Astral mages, but from the cheap ones. Shamans of C'tis, Seithkona of Utgård, even Vaetti of Iron Woods are cheap enough to use in killing Witch Hunters and even Grand Masters, as their spells could cause much havoc on more important units.