Vampire Queen mod

[Zapmeister]

Make all vampire like units receive double damage versus lances (stake through the heart).

It's a long time since I read "Dracula", but IIRC you would need more than double damage to emulate the wooden stake thing. The idea (I think) was that if you get the heart then it kills for sure, but if you miss it does nothing. Incremental damage plays no part in this.

If this could be implemented, then I agree it would be an effective and thematic way to downpower the VQ.

[PvK]

I was thinking the wooden stake would be a cheap misc slot magic item with the effect that if that character defeats a vampire using hand-to-hand combat, then the vampire's immortality doesn't work. That is, wooden stakes aren't melee weapons, but tools for permanently getting rid of vampires who are already in a helpless state.

PvK

[Cohen]

I'd remove Immortality first of all. Vampires can be killed.

The Fly is very useful, but I'd change it ... Vampires fly as bats, so it would be nice if this flying movement wouldn't allow to attack cause it's assumed the Vampire is in his bat form ... well he could change aspect at will ... but we've to limit it.

Regeneration ... why they regenerates? In fact Vampires are very healthy, but they drain life from their victims ... I'd add recuperation (that is now useful because Immortality fades in the void).

His draining attack ... I'd remove it cause VQ cannot bite in battle so easily without exposing herself to enemy strikes.

Ethereal ... this is fine.

Raise the new path cost ... to 70 or 80.

[Zapmeister]

I'd remove Immortality first of all. Vampires can be killed.

But not by normal means, i.e. melee. The immortality is definitely thematic, but I like PvK's method of removing it.

so it would be nice if this flying movement wouldn't allow to attack

Except that this would involve programming a new kind of flying. All units that fly currently can fly to attack.

His draining attack ... I'd remove it

Draining is perhaps the most recognizable and thematic trait of a vampire.

Ethereal ... this is fine.

But strictly speaking, it should be mistform. If you're looking for something to axe, this is a candidate.

Raise the new path cost ... to 70 or 80.

For sure.

[SelfishGene]

Has anyone tried modding Mistform instead of Ethereal for all vampire units and tried that out instead? Vampire myths aren't always consistent on how exactly they should be killed; Carmilla, for example, written in the 1840's, seems to emphisise decapitation and burning as well as staking. And neither are peculiarly magical forms of attack.

From some tests its clear any flying unit with regen, life drain, ethereal, mistform, MI, quickness, high prot/attack is going to kick ***, just some kick it more than others.

Another giant problem is life drain that early in the game. Once successful attack replenishes her fatigue, which is just as if not more important than the life siphoned off.

The basic problem with the VQ is that she just simply has too many natural spell effects. Get rid of a couple of them and she should be alright.

IMO get rid of fear (beauty), replace ethereal with mistform (so she has to use a cloak instead of armor) (and should be done for all vampires), remove regen (already has life drain), strength to 10 or 11. And maybe change Life Drain globally to not siphon or remove as much fatigue.

Edit: and change Immortality to not work if unit is fatigued out (100+).

[ April 20, 2004, 03:22: Message edited by: SelfishGene ]

[Graeme Dice]

Originally posted by SelfishGene:
Another giant problem is life drain that early in the game. Once successful attack replenishes her fatigue, which is just as if not more important than the life siphoned off.

The fatigue replenishment isn't important at all to a 0 encumbrance unit unless you are dealing with lots of opponents with air or astral magic.

And maybe change Life Drain globally to not siphon or remove as much fatigue.

This would harm all the non-undead units a huge amount more than the undead ones.

Edit: and change Immortality to not work if unit is fatigued out (100+).

Including the Liches? That would make them utterly useless as they will always be fatigued as spellcasters. I don't see why reforming their bodies automatically should have anything to do with whether they are conscious or not.

[SelfishGene]

Originally posted by Graeme Dice:
The fatigue replenishment isn't important at all to a 0 encumbrance unit unless you are dealing with lots of opponents with air or astral magic.

....

This would harm all the non-undead units a huge amount more than the undead ones.

...

Including the Liches? That would make them utterly useless as they will always be fatigued as spellcasters. I don't see why reforming their bodies automatically should have anything to do with whether they are conscious or not.

Hmm probably right, i added that suggestion without thinking it through as much at the end of the post. I also forgot the VQ was a 0 encumberance unit. However, fatigue does degrade a units defense and makes it easier to hit, and a VQ does have to accumulate some fatigue to cast her support magic. It might only help 10%, but it would help if that starting fatigue stayed with her longer. But your right about the immortality.

An ideal solution might be to change the Undead attribute into a unique Vampire attribute. That way you could easily add certain balancing weaknesses. Vampires are certainly undead but i think you could make a case that they are sufficiently different in the fiction to merit their own catagory. After all you don't have to die to become a vampire, or at least 'death' has some different meaning than death for something like an undead zombie.