Possible bug with lifedrain attacks? - developers please read

[archaeolept]

you aren't reinvigorated (using a wraithsword, for ex.) against undead either, though the attack will still cause damage to them. This seems correct to me - the auto attack success is wierd, though, as well as lifeless units taking fatigue (I haven't checked this personally - just going on what Zen said).

[AhhhFresh]

This is from the VQ Counters - NO debate

Where both Zen and Norfleet confirm that lifedrain attacks inflict fatique on their targets without hitting.

The feelings expressed there seemed to be that it was an SC balance decision, and not a bug...

EDIT: Just clarifying that if this is in fact a "bug", that fixing it may in fact make SC's invulnerable, so tread carefully

[ May 13, 2004, 16:00: Message edited by: AhhhFresh ]

[Norfleet]

Zen says that the fatigue is inflicted regardless of whether the attack penetrates protection: It's possible that the attack "hits", but doesn't inflict any damage through protection, but the fatigue is caused anyway. Since no physical damage is caused, mirror image doesn't fail.

Originally posted by Norfleet:
Zen says that the fatigue is inflicted regardless of whether the attack penetrates protection: It's possible that the attack "hits", but doesn't inflict any damage through protection, but the fatigue is caused anyway. Since no physical damage is caused, mirror image doesn't fail.

This is also true of anything that has a secondary effect but doesn't deal any actual damage. Though it may or may not be on the same level as Life Drain. Meaning, a weapon that has a secondary effect of poisoning, that doesn't actually hit through protection can still poison if the unit is not immune to poison. Same with things that have effects like "Tangle Vine". Some effects (Can't remember off the top of my head) require damage before they are applied AFAIK but Life Drain and numerous weapons with secondary effects do not.

[Gandalf Parker]

Hmmm if the code checked to see if the weapon hit then treated both effects as a hit or not hit based on that, how would that affect other weapons? Are all such weapons in that Category or are there some where the effects need to be checked seperately?

[PvK]

Seems pretty clear that there should be several categories, e.g.:

* Doesn't need to hit: wall of fire, gas cloud, heat/cold aura

* Needs to hit, but primary attack doesn't need to penetrate: astral weapon, electrocution, mage bane, elf bane

* Needs to hit, and needs to penetrate:
blood poison, venom, bane blade

What exactly each effect's requirements are is largely up to interpretation, though. The one that seems clearest to me though is venom versus armor - one should really need to get through external armor before causing poisoning, it seems to me.

PvK

[Stormbinder]

Originally posted by Kristoffer O:


Fatigue for free sounds suspiciously buglike.

That's what I thought. And it is confirmed behaviour, since all three of us - me, Norfleet and Zen, have seen it with mirror-imaged targets.


As for Zen's comments about possibiluty of lifedrain attak draining fatique witout penetrating target's protection - it is possible, of course but I think there is more than that.

My Air Queen for example, with 9 mirrorimages and high defense rating, was hit for fatique 2 times per turn, with every swing of Icedevil's sword. Even if she was drained because she was hit but her armor was not penetrated every time (which was quite unlikely in that case) the icedivel had to hit the one correct image out of 9 once or twice _every_ turn. It is possible but very unlikely statisically.

I think lifedrain attack could be buged twice in fact: first beacuse it is draining fatique despite dealing no damage, contrarery to the above quote by developres, and secondary because it ignores mirrorimages alltogether, always striking "correct" image.


In fact today my fully equpied Odin was attacked by AQ with wraithsword. Despite casting 7 mirror images authomatically he was instantly fatique-drained to 100+, because AQ was hiting him every or almost every singly time that she striked, withough inflicting any hitpoint damage or breaking mirrorimage. (and he was +4 defense on top of his defense boosting gear due to water 9, in addition to having 7 mirrorimages due to air3)