Speeding Up Tien Chi Spring and Autumn ?!

[Boron]

Originally posted by Vynd:
Whether Boron's strategy would work or not, to present it as an example of how S&A is a prefectly good theme seems silly to me. You can take terrible scales and a super-charged Pretender with any nation and any theme. So playing S&A this way is almost like playing no theme at all. Actually, it is worse than that, I think. Because there are other themes that actually reward you for having, say, a heavy cold scale, and thus are better at this sort of strategy than S&A is.

no other theme has as bad national troops as tien chi s&a .

so with forced at least turmoil 1 scale your income is anyway very bad compared to others .

[pinko commie]

Originally posted by Boron:

quote:

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Originally posted by Vynd:
Whether Boron's strategy would work or not, to present it as an example of how S&A is a prefectly good theme seems silly to me. You can take terrible scales and a super-charged Pretender with any nation and any theme. So playing S&A this way is almost like playing no theme at all. Actually, it is worse than that, I think. Because there are other themes that actually reward you for having, say, a heavy cold scale, and thus are better at this sort of strategy than S&A is.

no other theme has as bad national troops as tien chi s&a .

so with forced at least turmoil 1 scale your income is anyway very bad compared to others .

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What? Tien Chi doesnt have the worst national troops!! The archers are great, the cav is decent, and even the footmen and pikemen are ok for their cost (nothing to write home about, but not utter crap). I dont see how you can say this.

The scales you suggest are for Ermor. Only Ermor or maybe Pan CW can recruit researchers without money. If you have about 100 gold a turn, you can get a MotD every now and then, but you wont be able to recruit anything else, cant build temples or labs or forts, and have not a heck of a lot to research with or even make your summons or preach. Thus you will be purely vq-based and just have to hope that your dominion will be good enough to make sure she survives. Just sounds odd to me, not much like Tien Chi at all, sounds like Ermor without the theme and the undead. But I suppose the main question is: Is it fun??

[Pickles]

Originally posted by pinko commie:
" But I suppose the main question is: Is it fun?? "

for you & your opponents

Pickles

[Boron]

Originally posted by pinko commie:
What? Tien Chi doesnt have the worst national troops!! The archers are great, the cav is decent, and even the footmen and pikemen are ok for their cost (nothing to write home about, but not utter crap). I dont see how you can say this.

The scales you suggest are for Ermor. Only Ermor or maybe Pan CW can recruit researchers without money. If you have about 100 gold a turn, you can get a MotD every now and then, but you wont be able to recruit anything else, cant build temples or labs or forts, and have not a heck of a lot to research with or even make your summons or preach. Thus you will be purely vq-based and just have to hope that your dominion will be good enough to make sure she survives. Just sounds odd to me, not much like Tien Chi at all, sounds like Ermor without the theme and the undead. But I suppose the main question is: Is it fun??

i didn't write tien chi their troops are not bad i wrote tien chi s&a . really hard to find any other nation / theme who has worse troops than tien chi s&a .

if you don't have to much bad luck in the beginning with negative events although you chose luck 3 it is fun imho .

[rabelais]

My experience with S+A has been quite different from the Boards. It rocks right out of the box.

I have had the most success going uber scales....

T1/P3/temp0/G3/L3/M1 citadel magicless nata. Sure you don't get sacred bonuses, but you don't need 'em.

Your income, while not initally fabulous, is quite adequate, your nata is easily equipable (ice swords, etc) and/or disposable.

If a nomagic nata with sacred mages makes you nervous, an Earth 4 nata works well, but them you have to be VERY careful with it. At least until the healing heroine arrives.

The citadel keeps you off the early victim list in crowded conditions, and you can get a CM every turn after very mild expansion. And the spirits fodder are invaluable.

I *do* think the S+A sacred troops need a boost, in terms of the number that can be summoned per mage turn. As it is they are not cost effective.

Also, as a pet peeve, I'm not sure why the water spirits are *POOR* amphibians... They are elemental critters, I'd think they'd get a bonus in solution!

The DoHW are actually more accessible, since a lucky MotW can summon them. The DoHF, while lovely in theory... are much too difficult to obtain.


Rabe the S+A Fan

[Endoperez]

I think that Earth 4 Nataraja dying once, or even twice, is not earthbreaking. You can still cast Summon Earthpower and Invulnerability with E3 and 2, but the fatique you gets much higher.

[tinkthank]

Boron, why do you think that S&A troops are that awful? I agree with Rabe. (Except that I play with an Earth Mother, and have much success E4 N3, now all my paths are covered but blood -- depending on map and enemies, I take T1 / Prod 1 / Growth 1 / Luck 2 / Magic 3, Dominion 7, Castle -- I have enough money for CMs, get my heroes quickly, and can recruit some troops.)

I think the troops are decent. Composite Bows are fine for 10 gold and a strat-2 move! OK they are not as good as Man, or Caelum, or Tien default, but they are decent. The rest are acceptable for what they are. Plus there are Spirits out of the box, and Demons. (I agree that getting only 1 per turn is a bummer, but I think it is balanced.)

I certainly would have to disagree that S&A national troops are the "worst".