Unit cost advice - Mod related

[Kristoffer O]

Unit stats gives an approximate gold cost.
Unit equipment gives resource cost.

The res costs of different weapons and armors were scribbled onto an old paper laying around in JK's apartment. Since the development of Dom3 this stat has been removed from the units to each armor and weapon. Thus I can now give you the costs of an armor without having to go through papers on JK's desk (fortunately his desk was often tidy and clean).

There might have been slight changes to the costs since dom2, but not too much.

Shields (buckler, round, kite, tower, ice)
1,2,4,3, 9
Cuirass (leather, ring, scale, chain, plate, ice)
1,3,6,9,15,16
Hauberk (leather, ring, scale, chain, plate, ice)
2,5,9,13,20,22
Full (leather, ring, scale, chain, plate)
3,7,12,17,25
Barding (heavy cavalry)
20-30
Helmet (cap, full, ice cap)
2,6, 3
Weapons (dagger, spear, shortsword, broadsword, greatsword)
0,1,2,3,5
More Weapons (lance, morningstar, flail, mace, axe, battle axe)
2,2,3,1,1,3
Some ranged weapons (javelin, sling, short bow, long bow, comp bow)
1,0,1,2,3
Some more (crossbow, arbalest)
3,4
And ice (knife, mace, blade, lance)
0,2,4,2

Again, these are numbers from dom3, but I think they are valid for dom 2 as well.

This is not the full list. If some weapons are missing you probably have an idea by now what they should cost.

[Edi]

Whooaa! Methinks the Weapons & Armor DB is due an update...

Edi

[Agrajag]

Kristoffer O said:

*snip*
More information about DomII that Im going to keep. Thanks!

And what do you think about my (slightly retarted) gold cost rating system? Are there any abnormal ways to abuse it? (beside giving a unit 0 MR...).

[Zen]

You should also note that certain nations and certain themes have a reduction in gold/resource cost based on certain thematic reasonings. Nation balance for costs with this in mind also availiability of certain generic types of unit classes/magic availiable.

[Edi]

Well, updated W&A database, but another couple of questions:

Are the equivalents of base weapons that are made from unusual materials same cost, or +1 res cost to base item (e.g. coral weapons, amber armors)?

Does training possibly increase unit resource cost in some measure? I'm thinking of the Ulmish troops, for example. Oddly enough, some of the resource costs when don't add up based on the info given out above (e.g. hoplites and hoplite commanders have free weapons...).

I'm trying to do at least the common weapons into the W&A DB, and I'm extrapolating resource costs by adding up and subtracting things. Most stuff adds up, but there is the odd 1 or 2 resource deviation (armorers and blacksmiths cutting corners and making shoddier work?

So far Full Plate of Ulm appears to be between 25 and 27, though 26 appears to be the most common end result.

Also, units must cost a base resource of 1 to make the variable mean anything, so should I subtract that one from the total before I start figuring out unknown weeapons, or is the reasoning that [if Rescost == 0, then Rescost++] to eliminate the possibility of unlimited recruitment (as long as money is available, that is).

Edi

[Saber Cherry]

One way to price generic melee units (in gold) is to analyze their performance in the combat simulator, and price them proportionally...

Dom II currently has some inconsistencies in resource costs, especially between nations. This is because (prior to Dom III) all the unit resource costs have been calculated manually.

[Edi]

I know about the inconsistency, and I've been trying to take that into account when I've assessed the rescosts for the unlisted armors and weapons (not going to touch the magical ones, though!). It is still possible to calculate the costs if you do the math for several different units from all over the game, the inconsistencies I've found have been between -1 and 3 (only one of those). I'll be posting the updated W&A DB soon, with the derived ones listed with an asterisk to indicate that they are the most likely, based on my educated guesses.

Edi

[Kristoffer O]

Most units has a base cost of 1 (giants 2, not sure why).

There might have been changes to one or two of the armors.

Hoplites might have cost of iron cap while wearing full helm. IIRC that was discovered when we altered the costs.

[Wauthan]

Many thanks for your answers. Clears up some confusion on my part. I've made a similar list to the one Kristoffer O posted, based on ingame observations that Saber Cherry listed earlier. They don't match up very well. I think the units got edited a few too many times and resources don't correspond to any clear formula anymore. Barding for the mount does nothing in dom 2 and the first mod I made was to lower rcost on heavy cavalry and increase their gcost.

The Agrajag theory on factional technological unequality solves this problem quite neatly. Never thought about it that way.

Good and well. All my unit modifications and new armies are finished and the game works like I want it to. Illwinter can not be praised enough for supplying such powerful mod tools. It's great to be able to use light cavalry as the backbone of my armies.