Mictlan Pretenders ideas request

[Nagot Gick Fel]

archaeolept said:
the problem there being is that mictlan can only count on 1 water/turn, unless he's willing to alchemize his also limited astral income. might as well rush construction 6

Not my opinion, and I'd bet it isn't Zen's opinion either, for exactly the same reason - or then he wouldn't be so adamant about giving his pretender the required skills to summon IDs. Even if he didn't say it, I believe he'd beeline for Construction 4 before rushing for Ice Devils - because SDRs are just that important, as they double your Priests' output. When I play a Blue Dragon, my research plan is Alt 2 (Quickness), Ench 2 (BoW) - ie, giving the Dragon what he needs to fight efficiently -, then Constr 4 for SDRs - this also gives the Robe, the Brazen Vessel (ie, what a Rain Priest needs to summon IDs), as well a bit of gear to enhance the Dragon's survavibility. Then straight to Blood 5, and by the time I get there, there are just enough gems in the lab to forge a Robe, or close. So why would I ever push for Construction 6?

[archaeolept]

if you didn't put water 3 on your pretender

and if you did, empowering him in blood or starting him w/ blood 1 might be more efficient.

Again, a lot of these decisions affect others. One reason to rush for ID's is to provide a needed military boost to Mictlan fairly early, in order to compensate for a perhaps otherwise slow start. However, w/ a bless strat, especially a bless strat backed by an SC, early expansion isn't so much an issue, and grabbing all the IDs not so important (if there is even another nation looking like they're going for them). So w/ a bless/SC strat, I would normally just go to const 6 before heading for the blood summons. by the time i hit the IDs/ADs, any and all still available become mine.

Oh, and beating up on Abysia is a good idea too

[Nagot Gick Fel]

archaeolept said:
if you didn't put water 3 on your pretender

Hmmm, maybe I was lost in the thread, but I thought we were assuming a Water 3+ pretender here, since the point you replied to initially was just about that - choosing a pretender that could forge a Robe of the Sea.

and if you did, empowering him in blood or starting him w/ blood 1 might be more efficient.

The example I had in mind was a Blue Dragon, and buying him Blood 1 would be damn expensive in design points. And you'd need at least Blood 2 (thus 96 design points) since the whole point of this subthread was about rushing to IDs before researching Construction 6. If you want Construction 6 done before Blood 5, then the point is moot (because of Water Bracelets) and I fail to see what we're discussing here.

Of course, buying Blood + Water on a rainbow or half-rainbow pretender certainly would make sense - but the neat thing with the Dragon is you get a reasonably cheap level 9 blessing and fast access to IDs without having to spend a ton of design points.

So w/ a bless/SC strat, I would normally just go to const 6 before heading for the blood summons. by the time i hit the IDs/ADs, any and all still available become mine.

Hmmm, depriving the other nations from IDs is also important. Besides, when all you need is a water+1 and a blood+1 item, and you get them at Constr 2 and 4, what the hell is so important to you at Construction 6 so you can delay ID summoning - is it just to save 15 water gems, forging a bracelet instead of a robe?

[archaeolept]

again, one may not have water 3 on one's pretender. the thread is about mictlan pretenders, not solely those w/ water 3 ;p - the point replied to was "why one would ever go to construction 6". certainly when I spoke about going to construction 6 I was not considering myself to have taken Water-3 . Taking water 3 and forging a robe is plausible, in certain circumstances, of course (like a water dragon).

W/ a blue dragon, you could also consider empowering in blood and forging two +1 blood items at const. 4, or one +1 blood and two empowerings (110 blood and 100 blood respectively). That's a pretty heavy blood hit, but doesn't cost any design points, though the robe of the sea seems more attractive (20 water and 20 blood cost).

whether one needs/wants to rush for the ID depends upon who one is playing against, and what nations. As well, it depends on whether one is playing w/ the conceptual balance mod, where there is less reason to rush for them.

side note: I don't think "gosses" is much in vogue as an offensive slang term. you might get a smile though

[Nagot Gick Fel]

archaeolept said:
again, one may not have water 3 on one's pretender. the thread is about mictlan pretenders, not solely those w/ water 3 ;p - the point replied to was "why one would ever go to construction 6".

Well, I read this subthread slightly differently - to me it went like this

archaeolept said:

if you didn't put water 3 on your pretender

...which was obviously implied since the beginning.

certainly when I spoke about going to construction 6 I was not considering myself to have taken Water-3 . Taking water 3 and forging a robe is plausible, in certain circumstances, of course (like a water dragon).

OK, then we never were on the same wavelength - and I'll agree with you on that - Mictlan definitelty needs Construction 6 before starting to summon Ice Devils without water magic on its pretender. Question closed.

side note: I don't think "gosses" is much in vogue as an offensive slang term. you might get a smile though

I never implied it was offensive. In mainland France, "gosses" just means "kids", and I've been told by friends who went to Québec (and made the mistake I related) it was used for something completely different here. When you say "Let me show you a photo of my kids" and they understand "let me show you a photo of my ..." (well something Tarzan has a pair of, and Jane hasn't), it's still somewhat... embarassing.

[archaeolept]

heh

might as well rush construction 6

implies an alternate line of action, not dependent upon putting W3 on your pretender

I prefer an F9 blessing for mictlan. It gives a bit more punch, and the benefits to your SC are definitely greater. However, it does tend to preclude the ID rush, at least if you go for a dragon. The Golden Naga in zen's mod is a nice choice for all things though... (F9 W3 A3 E3 B1 should be possible, or close to it, w/ correspondingly ****ty scales. But mictlan can survive ****ty scales, so..)


i think "sales gosses" is even more evocative ;-)

[Nagot Gick Fel]

archaeolept said:
implies an alternate line of action, not dependent upon putting W3 on your pretender

You never give up, do you? OK, this round is yours. [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/ArrowRight.gif[/img]

I prefer an F9 blessing for mictlan.

So do I, actually.

i think "sales gosses" is even more evocative ;-)

Well, at least mine aren't. I go to the "douche" every morning.